User Respect Issues With Etcher
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In the thread on testing the Flidas RC, we started a discussion on updating the installation instructions, so they are as up-to-date as possible when Flidas is released. I suggested a cross-platform app called Etcher as a possible alternative to the many different tools and methods currently recommendeded for making a bootable disc/ USB from a Trisquel .ISO:
https://trisquel.info/en/forum/trisquel-8-codename-flidas-release-candidate-ready-testing#comment-130377
This began a discussion on various issues with Etcher that might be reasons not to endorse its use.
>> By the way, I don't find Etcher's opt-out of sending "user statistics" funny. <<
I agree this should be opt-in. They do seem to take user privacy seriously, and have gone to some effort to make sure no user data is sent before the user has the opportunity to go into the options and uncheck the stats collection, but I agree that's not enough:
https://github.com/resin-io/etcher/issues/1772
A user created an Issue on their GH, suggesting a pop-up on first use that allows users to opt-in (or not) to stats collection, like VLC does:
https://github.com/resin-io/etcher/issues/1770
Unfortunately, the devs are resistent to doing this, an attitude they justify by claiming that a yes/no dialogue on first start would spoil their UX. This seems disingenuous, given that the app already has a pop-on (on every start on my PC) asking:
"Should a desktop file for /home/strypey/Downloaded Apps/etcher-1.3.1-i386.AppImage be installed?"
Perhaps we could fork the code, make this change, and re-compile? Given their plans to integrate a UNetBootin-like system recommending all sorts of non-free images, a libre fork could be a good idea anyway:
https://resin.io/blog/the-future-of-etcher/
>> They also have "in-app purchases" (they promote hardware EtcherPRO). We shouldn't condone such behaviour. <<
This doesn't appear to be "in-app purchases", but rather an ad for their own product. Remember there's nothing unethical about trying to make money from free code software, and selling hardware that runs the software seems like an excellent way to do that. This issue is addressed here:
https://github.com/resin-io/etcher/issues/1957
Unless the hardware version contains proprietary code that's not part of the freely licensed code on GH, which doesn't seem to be the case, I don't see this as an issue.
Can you avoid ending quotes with "<<"? It makes your posts unreadable to mailing list users.
Really? I can't imagine why. It's a standard way of clearly indicating quoted text that I learned on mailing lists, when I first started using the net. Maybe the problem is your mail client reading email as HTML instead of plain text?
No, when I open the mbox file in vim I can see that the content is missing from the message itself. The two angle brackets and everything following are missing.
Even in my message here
https://trisquel.info/en/forum/user-respect-issues-etcher#comment-130456
which was sent from the mailing list, everything after the angle brackets is missing in the version I received from the mailing list.
The information must get lost in whatever process forum posts are forwarded to the mailing list. As onpon4 said here
https://trisquel.info/en/forum/does-playonlinux-work-trisquel-8#comment-130323
It probably has to do with removal of html tags used in the forum.
As discovered here: https://trisquel.info/en/forum/forummailing-list-discrepancies#comment-126160
If you actually want to type angle brackets that are not part of html tags, you can use '<' and '>'
That didn't work.
Use
'& lt;' for '<'
and
'& gt;' for '>'
with the space after the ampersand removed.
It would be nice if there were an option to make forum posts in plain text instead of html.
OK, my bad. Thanks for letting me know. I'll just have to resort to the non-geek method of using "" to mark quotes :)
Using the HTML codes for the signs should work just fine:
>> This is quoted text. <<
Result:
>> This is quoted text. <<
By the way, I got that to show up that way in the code tag by writing this out, if anyone wonders (I note that mason struggled to do so earlier):
&gt;&gt; This is quoted text. &lt;&lt;
Alternatively, even without using the html codes it's only the closing angle brackets that cause the problem You should be fine just including the opening angle brackets at the beginning of each quoted paragraph.
What a shame we can't use MarkDown in these forums. Has there any been any thought given to migrating these forums to a more user-friendly forum package like Discourse? Discourse does support MarkDown, as well as supporting email integration out-of-the-box (per forum, per board, per thread). Maybe after the Flidas release is over, this could be given some serious consideration? My skills in this area are limited, but I'm keen to upskill, and would be happy to help however I can.
As far as I understand, the proposed solution, for the future, is to use GNU Mailman 3, which somewhat provides a Web forum. See https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/ for an example.
Does Mailman 3 allowing posting on the web interface using MarkDown?
No, it does not. When you click the "Reply" button, you get your email client opening to write the reply.
MagicBanana on GNU Mailman 3 web interface:
"When you click the "Reply" button, you get your email client opening to write the reply."
That's not an improvement on the current forum. That would make it even less user-friendly than it is now!
Honestly, Discourse is a much better option. It work better for web users than the current forum (eg supporting MarkDown), and supports users who read and reply by email better too (eg you can subscribe to a board but unsub from threads that don't interest you).
OK, I see Discourse might have some freedom issues?
https://directory.fsf.org/wiki/Talk:Discourse
Another option is GroupServer (ZPLv2.1, Python/ Plone), which also allows full email participation with a full web forum interface. GS isn't in the FSD but that's because nobody submitted it yet (I will do that soon). I know some of the people involved and I'm confident it doesn't have any software freedom issues:
http://groupserver.org/
Another option is Loomio (AGPL, Ruby on Rails/ JS). It provides a web interface and email integration, and not just for discussion, but also a wide range of poll types. Although since these forums are just for discussion, Loomio is probably a bit over-engineered:
https://directory.fsf.org/wiki/Loomio
I'm not sure how well either of these support handhelds, since I don't use one. If anyone feels like doing some testing, I'd be keen to know the results.
That's great Heather. I really need the most minimal OS I can get for this old AA1, while still giving me a modern desktop UX, and I've been thinking about trying an Arch based distro for a while. Have you tried Parabola too? If so, how does Hyperbola compare?
I just used Etcher to burn Flidas main on to a USB, and I'm posting this from a live session using it right now. I will try making another bootable USB on the Mac, using Etcher, and see if it can get either of them to boot on it.
In other news, I had a chat on IRC earlier with TheAssassin (if you read the GitHub Issues I posted links to in the OP, you'll know who that is). We are going to fork Etcher, remove the annoying desktop shortcut pop-up, replace it with a stats collection opt-in pop-up on first boot (like VLC), and keep the minimal interface as is. Dev for the user-respecting Etcher fork will take place on GH, so we can easily merge in improvements to the core code, that don't affect the things we're removing/ adding. More news as it comes to hand.
Fedora Media Writer successfully writes Trisquel (or any other ISO) onto a USB flash memory. Select "custom image" and pick a file from your drive.
See my comment on the Flidas thread.
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