Cannot see all the install files on a CD

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pragmatist

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I want to try installing a program using WINE. However, the install CD detects my OS as GNU/Linux and only shows me the GNU/Linux install files (the reason I cannot simply install it in GNU/Linux is it is from 2004 and specifically requires much earlier kernels--and is designed for non-Debian distros)

To install on WINE I think I need the .exe file. How can I see everything that is on this CD (Windows install files, MacOS install files, GNU/Linux install files)? It is the strangest thing to me that I can mount this CD yet I cannot see two-thirds of what is on it!

I should also mention that this is the first time I'm using WINE and I'm clueless--but that is a second, less important, issue! :-)

SuperTramp83

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A rejoint: 10/31/2014

Once the CD is mounted you should be able to view all the files on it.

pragmatist

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That is the problem. I have mounted the CD manually and automatically. I have mounted it inside the Trisquel DE and I have gone into a VT, stopped X, and mounted from a text-only environment. In all cases I get the same three items. Two folders each labelled with the name of a GNU/Linux kernel version, and a readme file.

EDIT: I should mention that I know for a fact that this exact CD was used to install the program in Windows.

loldier
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A rejoint: 02/17/2016

You mean it has hidden partitions on it? Is it a Joliet CD?

pragmatist

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How do I determine that?

loldier
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pragmatist

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disktype /dev/sr0

--- /dev/sr0
Block device, size 233.6 MiB (244955136 bytes)
CD-ROM, 1 track, CDDB disk ID 02063A01
Track 1: Data track, 233.6 MiB (244955136 bytes)
Apple partition map, 2 entries
Partition 1: 1 KiB (1024 bytes, 2 sectors from 1)
Type "Apple_partition_map"
Partition 2: 233.3 MiB (244645376 bytes, 477823 sectors from 3)
Type "Apple_HFS"
HFS file system
Volume name "JMP IN 5.1"
Volume size 233.3 MiB (244613120 bytes, 59720 blocks of 4 KiB)
ISO9660 file system
Volume name "JMPIN51"
Publisher "ROBERT HICKEY, SAS INSTITUTE, INC."
Preparer "ROBERT HICKEY"
Data size 233.3 MiB (244647936 bytes, 119457 blocks of 2 KiB)
Additional Primary Volume Descriptor
Joliet extension, volume name "JMP IN 5.1"

I get the same result if I run disktype with sudo

At least there is an indication that there are MacOS files on the CD. It also says something about Joliet.

What do you make of this? Thanks.

EDIT: Also, when I tried using gparted, I get this:

The driver descriptor says the physical block size is 512 bytes, but Linux says it is 2048 bytes.

loldier
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A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Try 'blkid' as root. It will show the volume UUIDs. Maybe you can mount them separately.

http://linuxcommand.org/man_pages/blkid8.html

I think the CD is a hybrid disk.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_disc

Read this:

https://www.codeweavers.com/support/wiki/mac/faq/cxofficehybridmacmount

You'll probably have to use the '-t' option with 'mount' and tell it which filesystem to mount and where.

mount -t iso9660 -o ro /dev/deviceName /path/to/mount/point

This might be relevant, too:

https://www.skytale.net/blog/archives/2009/01/C5.html

Command 'kpartx'

http://linux.die.net/man/8/kpartx

This bit is interesting and might be of help in your case even if it is about Macs (the issue is the same, and they are both unices after all, GNU/Linux and MacOS):

http://superuser.com/questions/576153/how-to-mount-a-dual-hfs-iso9660-cd-as-iso9660-in-mac-os-mountail-lion

pragmatist

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Hang on, can I use fdisk with disk device: fdisk /dev/sr0 just like I would with a hard drive: fdisk /dev/sda

I will check right now...

pragmatist

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OK, I mounted the CD and used fdisk and cfdisk. With cfdisk I saw there is 244MB on the disk. When I go to the mount point and use du -hc I get 98MB So there is 146MB unaccounted for on this CD. I am only seeing 40% of the data on this CD.

pragmatist

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Update:

The information you gave was very useful loldier, Thanks! I still need to experiment some more with it. It is a less-pressing issue now that I was able to access the Windows files from my friend's Windows computer. From there I just copied them to a DVD and used it on my Linux computer to install with WINE. On Windows I was only able to see the Windows install files (not GNU/Linux, or MacOS)

The installation went OK, but unfortunately the software has 'expired' back in 2008. So when I run the program in WINE I get "this program has expired" window and I can't access the program. Naturally, this is not going to stop me from trying to use it! :) My friend did buy this back in 2004 and it still suits his purposes. So f*** these developers trying to force him to spend money on a new version just because he wants to install it to another one his own computers.

Now the main problem is:
how to get past the "this software has expired" so that the software is useable.

Secondary, but still useful to understand, is:
How to read all of the files (GNU/Linux, Windows, and MacOS) from the install CD using GNU/Linux

Thank you.

Magic Banana

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This forum does not assist the installation of proprietary software. Isn't there a free software equivalent?

pragmatist

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The person uses this for their job and the only software alternative has a very large learning curve. If they were beginners in their field of work, then the learning curve wouldn't be as bad. But this person has to do advanced things every day as part of their work. It is comparable to telling somebody that is not a computer programmer that they need to become a very strong programmer before they can continue with the work they need to do.

I will tell them that unless they are able to quit their job and learn the new program for a year, they will need to use this nonfree software within the Windows OS. They should use it in Windows but they should not use it on top of WINE in GNU/Linux. Even though when they use it with Windows they are using more than one nonfree program as well as all the other drawbacks of using Windows.

One question: If you are not willing to help people with WINE, then why is it available in the Trisquel repositories? Why do the Trisquel developers help people run nonfree software but the rest of the community does not?

loldier
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A rejoint: 02/17/2016

WINE for running free libre Windows code? Is there any?

https://notepad-plus-plus.org/

pragmatist

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You are right again loldier! Still I wonder what the empirical reality is regarding the use of WINE in Trisquel? Do most people use it to run libre Windows code?

I doesn't matter, because it is possible to use it for libre Windows code, and that is a good enough reason to include it in the repositories. Fair enough.

Thanks.

SuperTramp83

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> Still I wonder what the empirical reality is regarding the use of WINE in Trisquel? Do most people use it to run libre Windows code?

If I'd have to take a wild guess, 1 out of 100000.

ADFENO
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A rejoint: 12/31/2012

I don't know why some one brought up the excuse that "there's free
software that works only on Windows", because in this cases, it's
non-free, see:

https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/when-free-depends-on-nonfree.html

https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/java-trap.html.en

Magic Banana

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If the application runs on Wine, itself installed on Trisquel, there is no non-free dependency.

loldier
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Then again, there's DosBOX.

http://packages.trisquel.info/belenos/dosbox

I guess you can run FreeDOS on it. More likely, games.

ADFENO
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A rejoint: 12/31/2012

We're not telling person to use Windows to use that program. We're just
saying that, since the program is non-free, we won't help out on how to
use it since it's non-free.

It's best to use WINE.

pragmatist

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"We're not telling person to use Windows to use that program. We're just
saying that, since the program is non-free, we won't help out on how to
use it since it's non-free.

It's best to use WINE."

I understand and I accept this. In this case, it involved people close to me so I didn't see the forest because of the trees. I missed the bigger picture: that I was asking for help with nonfree software. This is something which I would never do on purpose. If for no other reason than I know what the reaction will be!

I am sorry for asking for help with nonfree software. Please understand it was not intentional.

Perhaps I will make a thread in the lounge to discuss this issue of "do the ends justify the means". Or, better yet, find an existing thread where this has already been discussed.

Thank you.

loldier
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>Now the main problem is:
how to get past the "this software has expired" so that the software is useable.

Secondary, but still useful to understand, is:
How to read all of the files (GNU/Linux, Windows, and MacOS) from the install CD using GNU/Linux<

Quite on the contrary. The main problem and point of interest is the hybrid file structure and how to make it work under GNU/Linux. What you call "the main problem" is out of scope on this forum, and you shouldn't have brought it up. Privately, you're free to do whatever you wish.

ADFENO
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A rejoint: 12/31/2012

Just tell us what do you want to accomplish with free software, that
we'll try to help.

You could simply say the name of the program, but this might be viewed
as recommendation for those uninformed.

If you're experiencing hardware problems, and what you're trying to
accomplish is to install a driver/module or firmware, then you can just
tell us the name of the hardware in detail.

loldier
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ADFENO
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Oh, then you can use:

GNU Octave: https://www.gnu.org/software/octave/

Or

GNU PSPP: https://www.gnu.org/software/pspp/

Right now, I only remember these.

I would like to provide more help, but statistics isn't my main field.

pragmatist

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Thank you for the suggestions.

"I would like to provide more help, but statistics isn't my main field."

Statistics is this person's main field. But I will mention your suggestions to him.

ADFENO
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A rejoint: 12/31/2012

You're welcome! He/she is also welcome to join the debate! It's always
nice to have/know people from various areas/fields of knowledge here.

My main focus is philosophical debates. My secondary focus is economic
(not to be confused with finance, because economics studies how scarce
resources affect the parties involved), accounting, marketing (not to be
confused with sales), public relations, and non-party politics (often
called public policy). I occasionally get involved in technical and/or
art[-making] debates, but my knowledge is very limited.

Magic Banana

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I would not say GNU Octave is an alternative. GNU PSPP really is (although it is a free clone of SPSS, not SAS). Gretl too (especially if the software is mainly use for regression). Real statisticians use GNU R (a programming language, with gazillions of modules for anything pertaining to statistics). I teach "Applied Data Mining" with KNIME (hundreds of nodes, a nice GUI, etc.). The CERN (crunching really a lot of data) uses the ROOT system. There are *many* good free software applications for statistics and data mining.

pragmatist

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"Real statisticians use GNU R"

This person has been a "real statistician" for many many decades. Graduated Harvard graduate school with PHD in Statistics, taught at a major university as a full professor with tenure for decades, discovered an entire area of Statistics, is a Fellow of the Academy of Arts and Sciences, has countless publications in all of the main journals as well as some non-statistics journals, has done consulting in the public and private sectors of great social and national importance, and was the thesis advisor for dozens of those "real statisticians".

He even taught a basic course one semester in GNU R! However, knowing the basics in R and knowing enough to do very advanced work are two very different things. Just as teaching an introductory course in C does not make you an advanced programmer in C

But you are correct about GNU R as a substitute for SAS. In fact, it is not only a substitute, but the above statistician told me that it is superior to SAS. But SAS does the job he needs to do and he does not have months to spend becoming an expert at R.

ADFENO
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A rejoint: 12/31/2012

Just an off-topic message to give you a fun fact:

During a debate on libreplanet-discuss, I became aware of a
teacher/professor which is also a free software activist, and according
to her, she usually rejects all the papers assigned to her to review
that use proprietary software, see:

https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/libreplanet-discuss/2016-05/msg00077.html

Magic Banana

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If he taught R, I doubt it would take him months to achieve advanced works with it. Like C, the language is not complex. It then becomes a matter of discovering the libraries with the appropriate functions and thinking algorithmically to glue things together.

pragmatist

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Yes, it is JMP which also came from SAS:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JMP_%28statistical_software%29

pragmatist

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Is it better to use:
(a) A nonfree program (JMP) on a free platform (WINE over GNU/Linux)
(b) A nonfree program (JMP) on a nonfree platform (Windows)

Not using JMP is not an option for this person at this moment. Maybe a year from now he will decide he does not need to use JMP. Does it make sense for him to use Windows until then? Should I tell him it is all or nothing? Give up all nonfree things today or don't even bother?

Magic Banana

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(a) is better but this forum still does not assist the installation of proprietary software. Notice that you will almost certainly not find any way to bypass the "time bomb". Even if you do, the effort you would have have put would certainly be far greater than the effort to learn R when you are a statistician and already knows R's basics.

pragmatist

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Yes, but getting a gratis copy of a non-expired newer version of JMP takes no effort at all.

I understand the policy of not helping with nonfree software and I accept it. I am just pointing out the dilemma as I see it.

As far as the programming language R, remember that these technologies are just tools--they are not the actual solution. If he has an adequate tool for the work he is doing, nothing fancier is necessary.

He is used to JMP, and he likes JMP. Why should he switch to R?

I will tell you the answer to that question: He should switch because freedom is more important than convenience.

So you can try and argue that he should use R instead of JMP, but it is not a relevant argument. A better argument is that if somebody wants to know what is the better tool in general, the answer is R. But we are talking about a specific person, not general advice for anyone.

You suggested R as an alternative to JMP, that was nice of you--thanks. Your comment that R is a very popular language is also useful--thanks.

If JMP is too slow running on top of WINE, then this is irrelevant. In that case the person will probably use JMP on Windows and--maybe--everything else on GNU/Linux. If it is not too slow, and I can get this person to spend all of their time on GNU/Linux instead of Windows, then running JMP on top of WINE is a small price to pay. Even if this person never goes beyond that (as you have mentioned by selecting choice (a) )