CDE -- Common Desktop Environment

69 réponses [Dernière contribution]
loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I installed CDE.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/08/09/cde_goes_opensource/

CDE was developed about 20 years ago as a unified desktop environment for all the various forms of commercial, proprietary Unix that dominated the workstation market back then: IBM's AIX, Digital’s Tru64, HP's HP-UX, Sun's Solaris, Silicon Graphics' IRIX and on x86 hardware, SCO's UnixWare. DEC even ported it to OpenVMS, which isn't a Unix at all, and in Linux's youth there was an $80 commercial version for Red Hat Linux 4.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Desktop_Environment

The Common Desktop Environment (CDE) is a desktop environment for Unix and OpenVMS, based on the Motif widget toolkit. It was part of the UNIX98 Workstation Product Standard, and was long the "classic" Unix desktop associated with commercial Unix workstations.

https://sourceforge.net/p/cdesktopenv/wiki/What%20is%20CDE%3F/

Here's how. Step by step instructions. It must be compiled from source.

https://mike632t.wordpress.com/2015/09/09/compiling-cde-on-debian-8-0-jessie/

Screenshot from 2016-05-16 19:25:52.png Screenshot from 2016-05-16 19:36:00.png Screenshot from 2016-05-16 19:41:22.png Screenshot from 2016-05-16 20:05:42.png Screenshot from 2016-05-16 20:04:32.png
root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

Would you use it daily, then?
I think Firefox looks somewhat out-of-place there. I think Dillo is a better fit for the 90s.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Lynx or Elinks could be more like it.

I tried to install it (CDE) alongside a regular Trisquel setup but failed. I wiped the laptop, installed minimal Debian with X support. The GUI wouldn't boot if I had other window managers.

I'll play with it for a while. It's a little bit long in the tooth. So far it's been fun. It's pretty usable as it is.

I used GeoWorks in the 90's. The Motif decorations remind me of it.

Screenshot from 2016-05-16 20:43:58.png Screenshot from 2016-05-16 20:40:39.png Screenshot from 2016-05-16 21:02:33.png
root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

Were you trying to boot from lightdm? Or were you trying
startx cde (or whatever it is)?
Some old window managers require you to make a special .xinitrc file. This usually works.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

At first I tried to follow this.

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2038452&page=5

Then I tried to make an Xsession file.

https://sourceforge.net/p/cdesktopenv/wiki/Createxsession/

It would hang at a blue screen with an hourglass.

https://sourceforge.net/p/cdesktopenv/wiki/SupportedPlatforms/

CDE may or may not compile on these platforms but will not actually work properly due to, among other things, dthello (the blue splash screen) getting hung up.

cde_menu.png photos.png dtinfo.png
grimlok
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 04/16/2013

Bummer, I thought you got it working in Trisquel! I tried doing it a while back, but just couldn't seem to make it happen. I really enjoy retro desktop enviroments and I wanted something that was more of a retro GNU/Linux desktop rather than just making a Windows 95 clone like I have now.

Nice to see it working anyways.

-grimlok

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I think you could try Trisquel netinstall. I don't see why it should not work the same.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I installed sound drivers. CDE doesn't seem to have any apps for sound except the beep. My Debian setup was minimal, so I had to add Alsa. Alsamixer GUI works nicely. I made a launcher for it.

https://wiki.debian.org/ALSA

Use sudo or open a root terminal (su). Debian has root account enabled as default. I didn't install sudo.

apt-get install libasound2 libasound2-doc alsa-base alsa-utils alsa-oss alsamixergui

Configure Alsa as root for hardware.

alsactl init

I also realized CDE has no dialog for shutdown or restart, only exit GUI. I open a Terminal and (as root) type 'init 0' for shutdown and 'init 6' for restart. Only an administrator is supposed to shut down a Unix computer.

I installed Gnome Mplayer but there's an issue with the video screen size. It won't go any bigger than a matchbox or postage stamp. Vlc works fine.

brubeck_cde.png blue_rondo_cde.png gnome_mplayer.png
root_vegetable
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A rejoint: 10/26/2015

Mplayer in the terminal, or just try VLC?

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I noticed some Gnome programs cannot be resized. Like Evince, but it's of decent size and PDFs are legible. I replaced Evince with MuPDF

I installed SMplayer. Works just fine.

cde_janus_firing_up.png
root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

those icons... yuck

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

SMplayer? The interface can be changed.

novena_cde_3.png novena_cde.png novena_cde_5.png
grimlok
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 04/16/2013

I really like the look of it. I love the nice crisp and clear non-smoothed fonts! And the beautiful pixel-art icons!

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I think the desktop decorations are 16 colours VGA. Fonts are crisp. A computer interface must look like it's a computer, not a printed newspaper or a brochure. Form follows function.

I love the way the menus from the front panel can be detached and dropped on the workplace desktop.

debian_cde.png cde_vi.png Screenshot from 2016-05-17 15:28:38.png cde_desktop.png
root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

It's actually kind of appealing, in a retro 90s way, like Game Boy games or astronauts' space snacks. In a 90s way, mind. Are you intending to actually use it every day?

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

So far, yes -- until I get bored. I'll definitely come back to this again if need be now that I know how to do it.

There are people who still use OS/2 (Ecomstation) or RiscOS. CDE is free software.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RISC_OS

CDE is basically like Xfce 3 or Solaris. After all, it's only a skin. Underhood, it's a modern OS (in this case Debian powered GNU/Linux). You have all the software out there plus what you can find for the CDE system (native programs seem to start with a 'dt' every one of them).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xfce#Early_versions

There's a tutorial here.

https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E19504-01/802-5817/book-info/index.html

Comparison Xfce 3 and Solaris CDE.

https://youtu.be/DVko001y2Cg

xfce3.jpeg Xfce3x.jpg
Calinou
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 03/08/2014

> A computer interface must look like it's a computer, not a printed newspaper or a brochure.

I disagree with this. There's a reason the industry is pushing for high-DPI monitors: pixelated fonts are just ugly and harder to read than crisp, anti-aliased fonts.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Of course they are better. A Retina display is overwhelmingly good to look at. I'm not saying screens shouldn't be sharp. The same way a good, soft couch is easier to sit on than a hard surface. I just don't need that bling.

On my laptop screen CDE looks very good. It's enough for me.

I was talking about an interface that's disguised as something else than a computer. I guess it's familiarity and stubborness on my part. You feel like you're not in control.

Take old motorcycles or scooters with manual gears. Then compare them with a twist & go.

I want to keep things simple so that I can understand them.

The same applies to modern web design. I just want the text and something to click, the links.

Look at this rudimentary html:

http://stars.astro.illinois.edu/sow/sowlist.html

Stallman's site:

https://stallman.org/

elinks_star_stallman.png aldebaran_kalers_stars_elinks.png
oysterboy

I am a member!

I am a translator!

Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/01/2011

Wow, that's a blast from the past as far as I am concerned. Memories of my first internship in 1996 :)!

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

As time passes, old is new again. Fads come and go but the basic desktop metaphor (which CDE is) remains. All else is icing on the cake.

Would love to see somebody making a CDE packaging for a distro so that it could be optional when installing the system.

Screenshot from 2016-05-18 11:39:31.png cde_tutorial.png
grimlok
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 04/16/2013

Wouldn't it be cool to have a CDE-based Trisquel!? I wonder how to go about doing such a thing.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

It sure would be a good project for a mini Trisquel.

There used to be a version of Debian 6 called CDEbian (probably unofficial, a one-man job). So it's possible and not far-fetched.

Somebody has given a download link here.

http://www.securitronlinux.com/bejiitaswrath/a-look-at-the-cde-unix-desktop-running-on-debian/

I don't know if the ISO is original. I doubt it because the guy gives the root password as 'Harlemshake! It's a live CD (about 700 MB).

This archived page is likely the original compiler (andarazoroflove) but his download links are all gone dead.

https://archive.is/WWsQm

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I missed Xclock, so I installed package 'x11-apps'.

https://packages.debian.org/jessie/x11-apps

apt-get install x11-apps

As a bonus, the Xeyes now keeps watch. Better than the Clippy who must die. No X desktop is complete without the rolling eyes!

There's a digital timepiece in CDE and an analog clock in the front panel. More clocks is less unawares.

xclock_xeyes.png huge_eyes_cde.png
root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

No retro x desktop is complete without xsol:

9204_large.png
loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

You're right. Thanks. I installed package 'xsol' successfully. Tried to launch it -- 'command not found'. Then looked for it in /usr/games/. It must be launched with the path (or first create a launcher).

Here it is.

xsol.png xsol_about_cde.png
loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Here's a video tutorial how to edit and replace launcher icons in CDE's Front Panel Subpanels (menus).

https://youtu.be/O8zpHtXL2Jg

I changed most of the generic icons that I found and initially used before I knew better. CDE only comes with a limited set of pixel art.

--find, download an icon be it svg or png
--scale icon to 32 by 32 pixels (Gimp)
--save/export as 'example_icon.xpm' whatever as long as the extension is right
--copy to .dt/icons/ folder changing the name to 'example_icon.pm'
--open App Manager --> Desktop Apps --> Create Action
--create launcher, edit icon, save
--drag & drop the launcher icon from your File Manager folder to the Front Panel menu place holder 'Install Icon'
--refresh menu by restarting Workplace Manager (right-click on the desktop)

cde_app_menu.png cde_scale_icon.png
loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I said earlier that Gnome apps, some of them, can't be resized. They don't get the Motif decoration but use their own instead. These are somehow dependent on Gnome 3 design decisions.

Gthumb, once maximized from the desktop icon right-click menu, won't leave full-screen no matter what I do. It does work flawlessly apart from this issue.

I found that Mate apps work better together with CDE. Caja for File Manager (CDE's native FM is pretty archaic), Eom (Eye of Mate) for images.

cde_fman_caja.png eom_cde_about.png
root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

I personally prefer programs that are desktop environment-agnostic, like gPicView.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Yes, I have that installed. You're right, GPicView is probably the best match for CDE.

There's another issue with Firefox/Iceweasel. When maximized, the browser goes 'overboard', that is, it maximizes to something four times the actual screen size. The window can be alt-dragged back to form, so no big deal but something to consider.

'"Desktop environment-agnostic" is the way to go. I'd say Mate's your uncle as far as CDE goes.

cde_gpicview.png fx_iw_oversized.png
loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Tips how to overcome some limitations and add functionality to CDE.

http://myria.math.aegean.gr/~atsol/newpage-en/software/cde/

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Oops, mispost!

While I'm at it, I might as well put something useful here: good Solaris screenshots.

http://www.guidebookgallery.org/screenshots/cde15solaris9

Some background history of CDE.

http://www.osnews.com/story/18969/pt_VII_CDE

Solaris CDE User's Guide.

http://docs.oracle.com/cd/E19683-01/806-4743/index.html

root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

I recently tried FVWM. The Window borders are similar to CDE. I like it well enough. Maybe I will stick with that instead.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I think there should be Motif look-a-like themes for Xfce on Xfce-Look.org.

http://xfce-look.org/content/show.php/CDE+Solaris+Fix?content=164361

root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

Vezhniyi Vid!

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Vneshnyi vid. Внешний вид. Looks or appearance. 'Outer view'.

That's what matters. Say C-D-E. Common sense Desktop Environment. Loco-Motif or motive power.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motive_power

I really hope it won't die any time soon.

root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

The package xfwm-themes provides two themes similar to what I was looking for. The first is called mofit, clearly a sort of play-on-words. The second is called platinum, and is similar in function. I have vowed to use the GNU tiling wallpaper wherever possible from now on.

mofit-xfwm-theme.png platinum-xfwm-theme.png
loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

That Mofit theme looks authentic. It's good to know it's available. Thanks.

root_vegetable
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A rejoint: 10/26/2015

The GTK theme is xfce-stellar, in case you are curious. It has become somewhat more to my liking recently.

root_vegetable
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A rejoint: 10/26/2015

Do you have any idea why CDE is not packaged for Debian yet? There is a package called cde but it is something else. So I suppose you could call it cde-desktop?

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I don't know what the complications are specifically but this is what they say here.

https://sourceforge.net/p/cdesktopenv/wiki/LinuxBuild/

"CDE on Linux is not yet to the point of being simple to package for distribution or a relatively simple to compile from the source archive."

Lack of interest or the port is not ready for primetime yet.

I really like the look of Motif decorations. If you use a dock with Xfce, it will be functionally very similar. Remove the panel and start apps from desktop (workplace) menu with the right click of the mouse. I wonder if the native apps dtterm and dtfile work without the full desktop in Xfce. I guess they need the mwm Motif window manager to work.

I attached a file with the standard CDE XPM and XBM backdrops.

Dthome.l.png Dtterm.l.png
Fichier attachéTaille
cdewallpix.tar 550 Ko
cdeicon.tar 10 Ko
cdeiconpack.tar.bz2 288.08 Ko
root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

Did you build it and then use make checkinstall? This supposedly produces a .deb archive. I will try.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I did it step by step as detailed in the instructions. I didn't try anything else. If you succeed, it would be far easier to do a reinstall.

root_vegetable
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 10/26/2015

It seems to be made up of several separate programs so each would need to be packaged individually.
Quick and dirty Debian packaging is actually reasonably simple. You make a file with information about the package, and you put the compiled files in folders corresponding to where they should be installed on the system.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I think if it was as simple as packaging they would've done it. Maybe maintenance is an issue.

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

This is Dthello, the CDE splash screen. It shows the version of CDE when starting but I could not capture that, only the background. Nowadays, computers are too fast for the eye to catch but a glimpse of the splash screen.

*EDIT*

Dthello prints on screen the contents of /usr/dt/copyright

This can be invoked from the console:

dthello -file /usr/dt/copyright

I don't know why in the screenshot the text is truncated.

*EDIT*
It's the Gnome Screenshot that wipes a portion. I had to launch it with delay before issuing the command dthello. The captured screen can now be used as a backdrop in /home/user/.dt/backdrops. Convert the file to XPM first and truncate the extension to PM.

dthello_cde.png dthello_copyright.png dthello_full_cde.png cde_dthello_backdrop.png
Fichier attachéTaille
dthello.tar 10 Ko
dtlogo.tar 440 Ko
loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Applications are usually iconized/minimized on the desktop/workspace but there's a box that can be toggled on in the settings -- the Icons Window. This box can be iconized itself and every workspace (1--4) can have a different box with different software running. The icons stay in the box even when the program window is open.

I like this feature. I think KDE has something similar on the desktop -- a transparent window that can contain launchers, widgets and folders.

cde_iconsbox_2.png cde_iconsbox_workplace2_2.png cde_iconsbox_iconized.png cde_iconbox.png cde_styleman.png
loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I put a screenshot of Solaris CDE in the wallpaper thread. It's kind of misplaced but here's the link.

https://trisquel.info/en/forum/old-fashioned-tiled-wallpaper?page=1#comment-96905

loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

I'm trying to read a Debian CD-ROM. The Dtfile file manager won't automatically mount the CD. Well, I did that in the terminal and can now access the CD in the file manager /media/cdrom/.

There are various ways to browse. I can use 'cat' command to print the text of a file in the terminal or I can drag and drop the icons to the workspace desktop, then close the file manager. The icons on the desktop are temporary symbolic links to the CD. Clicking on them will open the file in Dtpad text editor. The links can rest on the desktop all day and with a right-click I'm able to go back to the parent folder.

I could just use Caja which mounts and shows and opens all necessary viewers at a click of the mouse. But that would not be fun.

There used to be a tool for this called Removable Media Manager (RMM) that's supposed to work seamlessly with the Dtfile file manager. Can't find it in my setup. I think it's not there.

http://linux.die.net/man/1/cat

https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E19683-01/806-4743/removablemedia-31/index.html

readme_cat_dtpad.png readme_cdrom_debian.png open_parent_folder_cde.png
loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Application Manager has a default set of apps and you most likely want to add some more.

As root, go to /etc/dt/appconfig/appmanager/C

'C' is default English, if you use another, go to the respective language folder.

Make directories for Internet, Games, Accessories, Video_and_Sound or any other folders you like. The path would be something like '/etc/dt/appconfig/appmanager/C/Internet'.

As root, type:

mkdir /etc/dt/appconfig/appmanager/C/Accessories

cp /home/user/Gimp /etc/dt/appconfig/appmanager/C/Accessories/Gimp

Where 'user' is your login name.

Copy from /home/user/ all application Actions you want to see in these respective folders. When you are done, refresh App Manager --> Desktop_Tools --> Reload Applications. You should see the newly added icons in their app groups.

https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E19455-01/806-1361/6jaldfjj5/index.html

Note:

You must have created launchers called 'Actions' first with the 'Create Action' app. Actions are launchers with icons for Iceweasel, VLC and any other apps you may have installed. You can drag and drop these Actions to your Front Panel menu for easy access.

https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E19455-01/806-1361/6jaldfjkl/index.html

*EDIT*

After rebooting the system has apparently done some cleanup and moved everything from /etc/dt/appconfig/appmanager/C to /var/dt/appconfig/appmanager/user-hostname-0/. All new entries in existing app groups must be created here.

appman.png appman2.png appman3.png appman_reload.png
loldier
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 02/17/2016

Gnome ALSA Mixer is a GUI for Alsa sound utils. It's old-school enough to fit in seamelessly with CDE. I installed it from a deb package provided by Ubuntu since it was not available in Debian Jessie.

http://packages.ubuntu.com/trusty/gnome-alsamixer

As root:

dpkg -i gnome-alsamixer_0.9.7~cvs.20060916.ds.1-5_amd64.deb

Fix dependencies:

apt-get install -f

http://linux.die.net/man/8/apt-get

There's another GUI for Alsa that installs together with the Alsa Utils.

alsamixergui

cde_gnome_alsamixer.png cde_alsamixer_GUI.png