mastodon/gnusocial/disapora/minds/etc - free software social networks and federation

10 réponses [Dernière contribution]
PrimeOrdeal
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 09/15/2019

Do trisquel users have any comments/recommendations on social networking with free software and has anyone tried the federation options? If I understand correctly(?) it is possible to spot simultaneously to multiple networks - is that a two way communication option or is it broadcast only? Is it good?

The ones which came to my attention so far are mastodon, GNUsocial, diaspora, minds... thanks for any thoughts!

commodore256
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 01/10/2013

The problem is they're an echo-chamber and it's junk for your brain. RMS said social media in itself isn't a bad thing, he just doesn't like black-boxes and he doesn't use them because they don't appeal to him. I like RMS' reasons for not using it, but I'll go further and say social media isn't what the internet is supposed to be.

The internet is supposed to IRC, XMPP, Mumble, eMail, Forums, Geocites/Neocites and self-hosted in your closet like peertube or your own site. This is what the Internet is supposed to be: https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/ (Though depending on the time you read this the site might be down, when the battery dies, the server goes offline)

The internet is supposed to be a post-office and I think even decentralized social media is brain junk food because of the way it's designed with reward brain chemical hackery. So in a way, it hacks your brain.

Beko
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 08/31/2019

>The internet is supposed to IRC, XMPP, Mumble, eMail, Forums, Geocites/Neocites and self-hosted in your closet like peertube or your own site.

Not if Amazon Web Services can help it!

commodore256
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 01/10/2013

AWS? Where we're going, we won't need AWS. :P

strypey
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 05/14/2015

commodore256:
> The internet is supposed to IRC, XMPP, Mumble, eMail, Forums, Geocites/Neocites and self-hosted in your closet like peertube

A few things.

1) All the existing federated social web software is free code and can be self-hosted, or community-hosted. It's up to the user whether they host their own instance or choose from the existing ones.

2) PeerTube is a federated social media app. It uses the ActivityPub social web protocol to connect PeerTube instances (servers) with each other, and PeerTube channels can be followed by users on instances of any other software that uses ActivityPub, including Mastodon and Pleroma.

3) There are also federated social media apps that use XMPP as their federation protocol, including Movim and Salut-a-Toi. While fediverse apps using OStatus and ActivityPub have done a pretty good job of building decentralized replacements for Titter and ThemTube, XMPP may be a better protocol for building a decentralized replacement for FarceBook, because it can better imitate the relationship between the FB website and the FB Messenger app. The main thing Movim and SaT are missing at this point is a way to handle event invitations, RSVPs etc.

PrimeOrdeal
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 09/15/2019

Whether or not one personally approves of social media the fact is that many humans enjoy communicating via facebook, twitter, etc. Political parties from all sides of the spectrum use it to communicate supposedly efficiently to many followers. From this point of view, for all its weaknesses, social media sites are part of human society and communication. In some ways its similar to past communication methods such as newspapers or TV. Newspapers and TV have their own weaknesses, including the possibility of owners wishing to manipulate democracy.

My fear about facebook and twitter is that one day it might be possible that an undue influence is applied to them so as to positively amplify certain views and negatively amplify other views, thereby manipulating supposed free speech within supposed democracies. Perish the thought such a day may have already arrived.

Commodore sir, you say that social media is an echo chamber but its obvious that on sites such as twitter one gets dissenting views and opposing arguments can be presented. I have seen it and I think that is not an echo chamber.

This is why I am in favour of the principles of decentralised social media. I'm not bothered by the fact that have much fewer users than the mainstream centralised social media. Having said that I did not yet try them and I suppose I just have to jump in and see for myself but I just wondered if anyone in the Trisquel forum had any views and experience with "federation". Thanks for the messages so far...

commodore256
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 01/10/2013

Social media is an echo-chamber and it encourages idealogical partisan hackery. Where are the "taxation is theft" people on Mastodon? Sure you see, "Rent is Theft", "Taxation is theft", "#GreenNewDeal", "#MAGA", "#KickVic", "#IStandWithVic" and "Bash the Fash" and other partisan hack culture war bullshit on Twitter, but if there's dissent, it's like all parties are yelling on megaphones cranked up to 11 with their tribal bullshit and not acting like they're in a Coffee Shop. Decentralization isn't going to solve the problem because Republicans that might be interested in decentralized social media would just get their own echo-chamber and that doesn't solve the problem. Because Mastodon doesn't like Republicans and Republicans don't like people that don't like Republicans. It's garbage designed to hack your brain and hack those reward chemicals.

People need more analogue lives. People are looking for enemies online when they look for people outside their tribe. People have forgotten how to be real with everybody.

Social Media is garbage and I'd rather have friends in meat space. You know, shake hands and give hugs.

https://invidio.us/watch?v=dRl8EIhrQjQ

strypey
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 05/14/2015

commodore256:
> Where are the "taxation is theft" people on Mastodon?

There are heaps of propertarians on the fediverse, some of them even run their own Mastodon instances. Mastodon is only one of the fediverse server apps using the ActivityPub protocol. Another is PeerTube, which you endorse so ...

> Social media is an echo-chamber

An "echo chamber" is not created by this or that technology. It's created by people's choices to filter out voices that disagree with them and interact only with people who do. In the newspaper era you could create an echo chamber by reading only the newspapers that shared your political biases, and only discussing politics with people who read the same newspapers.

The corporate platforms like FarceBook, Titter, and ThemTube, have various algorithms that tweak what we users do and don't see, based on what makes them spend the most time on the platform looking at ads. That can make the echo chamber problem worse in various ways (and the partisan screeching match problem). But that's a function of the ad-diven, datafarming business model of those platforms. Those problems are not inherent to web-based social networks, and decentralization actually mitigates many of them.

PrimeOrdeal
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 09/15/2019

Ok. Thanks for your views commodore. In my view its possible to meet people in reality as well as participate with online forums of various kinds. But in principle social media/internet communication can more easily reach greater numbers of people so if you have a message to spread or defend I think its fair enough to use it. I'd say this forum we are writing in here is a form of social media, or to put it another way "a form of communication". If you choose not to use forms of social media or forms of communication then that's surely simply a matter of personal choice and freedom.

FindEssential
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 08/23/2017

I use GNUsocial for my daily gratitude journal and it works well. The service is very easy to use, it even works with Lynx. I don't really communicate with "followers" or anything like that, I just find that I am more likely to post daily if its a public thing as opposed a private journal. Even though I don't seek interaction, I have had some people reach out to me offering thanks for using the platform in a positive way.

Social media is a tool and like any tool it can be used for a force of good. Unfortunately, because of the pervasive pain, loneliness, and culture of outrage we all live in... it is often not used as a force of good. Like a hammer it could be used to build a house in responsible hands...or rip one down in malicious hands. Social media isn't the problem (especially if you use a free as in freedom platform), our intentions with its use are.

strypey
Hors ligne
A rejoint: 05/14/2015

I have been doing research for fediverse.party, which aims to be a user-friendly introduction to the federated social web. I aim to inform the ongoing development of the fediverse.party site by helping to keep the information on these wiki pages up-to-date:
https://gitlab.com/fediverse/fediverse.gitlab.io/wikis/

We currently define the fediverse as a meta-network made up of any webserver running social web software that can implement one or more of four protocols (in order of age); OStatus, Diaspora, Zot, and ActivityPub.

PrimeOrdeal:
> If I understand correctly(?) it is possible to spot simultaneously to multiple networks - is that a two way communication option or is it broadcast only?

A webserver running software using those protocols is called an "instance", which is usually known by its domain name. Whichever instance you join, you can interact with other users on any other instance that communicates via at least one of the protocol(s) that the software on your instance uses. All communication on the fediverse is two way, but most of the apps give you some ways to mute or block other users who are spamming, flooding, or abusing you, or otherwise being a nuisance.

> Is it good?

That's a matter of opinion ;) I have had some great conversations on the fediverse, even made some friends, one of whom I've since spent some time hanging out with in person. I've learned about a lot of new developments in software and politics, and seen some very funny jokes and memes. I've also been bullied and harassed on a few occasions, and got into a few arguments that I might have been best to avoid. YMMV ;)

What I suggest you do is set up a Friendica account on a site like Libranet, and lurk for a while. You can search for hashtags (eg #GNU) and read the conversations threads that included those tags. You can click on the username of any poster in those threads who and read their recent posting history. If you like what you see, you can start following people whose posts you'd like to read regularly, and replying to posts you find interesting.

Friendica implements OStatus, Diaspora, and ActivityPub, so you can get a pretty good overview of a larger cross-section of the fediverse than if you use Mastodon, which now only has ActivityPub support (they recently dropped OStatus and never implemented Diaspora). GNU social only uses OStatus, although an ActivityPub implementation is in the works.

If you'd like to interact with me on the fediverse, I am:
name at domain, or name at domain