Orientation Advice
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Dear Community,
What is the best GNU/Linux distribution for a Macbook (late 2007, with BroadCom Networking Adaptor)?
I have installed gNewSense (as Richard Stallman uses this?), however, I cannot get connected to the Internet over Wireless.
I had a quick attempt at installing the latest Linux Libre Kernel, however, it requires QT4, and I'm not connected to the Internet (when in gNewSense).
Is it worth carrying on with the diagnosis of said Wifi problem (also audio isn't working, also trackpad isn't doing a right-click), or would it be better to install Trisquel (which has a more up-to-date Linux Libre Kernel) and which may perhaps configure the driver support?
I would like to learn how to interface with hardware, whilst also learning how to display geometry (to combine the best of both worlds).
I has taken me until 36 to realise that you need to know the core.
Best Wishes,
Dave a.k.a. Wulgulmerang.
PS: I think Nicola Telsa would have enjoyed GNU :-)
By the way, I love this picture. For some reason the attached picture (PNG) isn't showing :-|
I am a translator!
In order to know whether the wireless card is supported please paste output
of this command:
$lspci -nnk | grep "Network controller"
I am pretty sure that the desktop packages of gNewSense, in its latest stable
release, are not updated anymore. This "belief" is justified by the fact that
this release was based on Ubuntu 8.04 LTS, which does not provide such
updates anymore. I invite anybody who would have recently used gNewSense to
confirm or infirm.
If I am right, using gNewSense does not seem such a good idea (security
risks, uncorrected bugs, etc.).
Today, Trisquel is, among the free GNU/Linux distributions, the most popular
(and it deserves it!). Parabola seems to gain many users too but requires
quite some experience in administrating GNU/Linux (and the wish to spend time
to do so).
The latest Trisquel (5.5 Brigantia) uses a rather recent Linux-libre kernel
(version 3.0)... but it may not drive your Wifi card because many
manufacturers do not distribute their firmwares under a Free license (they
are blobs in the Linux kernels that are removed by the Linux-libre project).
Taking a look at the output of 'lspci' allows to identify the Wifi chipset
and search the Web for free drivers and firmwares... but without much hope
(most free drivers already are in Linux-libre).
If no free solution can drive your Wifi card, the recommended solution is to
acquire a freedom-friendly replacement. ThinkPenguin is an excellent place
where to buy such hardware since a) it is *guaranteed* to perfectly work with
Linux-libre (hence Trisquel) and b) by using this link (the "libre" part of
the URL is important), 25% of the benefits made on your purchase are donated
to the Trisquel project.
If you use [pre]make menuconfig[/pre] instead of [pre]make xconfig[/pre], you
won't require the QT libraries.
Use "make help" to list all of the possible configuration targets.
For a newbie Free Software supporter, I can only recommend to install
Trisquel with Gnome, and concerning your hardware, there is a web page, where
you can check whether your wifi card is compatible with the libre kernel.
Here is the link:
When starting with 100% Software Libre, I had to replace the wifi card on one
of my laptops.
I checked out h-node, and found this wifi USB dongle:
http://tinyurl.com/7kfermt
Listed on Amazon:
http://tinyurl.com/d8xx377
Do you think I could just plug it in to the Apple hardware, and work round
the issue like that?
I am a member!
I believe that card is not compatible. There are a few versions of it and one of them will work... although it is more expensive.
Using a USB wifi card to solve the non-free driver issue with an internal card should generally speaking work.
If you can I'd suggest replacing the internal card. This may not be a good idea on a Mac though. They tend to be difficult to get apart and put back together again.
I have installed Trisquel 5.5 (the 700MB download), however, it doesn't come
with any "make" or "gcc" developer commands.
The openfwwf driver didn't pick up the BroadCom 4321 hardware, so I couldn't
use wifi.
Somebody recommended checking out the h-node site, to find linux libre
compatible hardware.
I found this wifi USB dongle, which I could potentially use, as a workaround.
http://tinyurl.com/d8xx377
Is it worth installing the BroadCom proprietary driver as a workaround? What
would be the easiest way?
I am moving house in 3 days, and the new place has got a router. Which I
could plug into with an ethernet cable.
One thing I noticed on gNewSense, what that all development tools were
preinstalled. There were also entries in "info" and "man" for understanding
complex numbers (possibly there were vector entries as well).
Does anybody know how to install the most complete "info" and "man"
documentation?
I am a member!
Nobody here is going to recommend installation of a non-free driver/firmware or help you with it. The primary benefit of Trisquel is freedom. If you are really following the free software philosophically rather than the "open source" philosophy the non-free "option" isn't an option. If you are going to go this route there are other distributions you would go to instead. Most distributions are largely free although problematic for technical (and ethical) reasons related to non-free software.
Trisquel's technical benefit would be it doesn't include these non-free components so you know where at least some problems will likely arise going forward had you chosen a non-free distribution (particularly in relation to support for hardware- although as Adobe and Oracle have shown this applies to critical software components too). In any case Trisquel makes it easy to select the right stuff the first time around.
I agree with you Chris.
What about a FaiF hardware platform? The Think Penguin Linux Libre platform
contains proprietary hardware?
I understand the implications of not running or understanding FaiF software
and hardware. The information war is set to continue into the BioTech and
NanoTech futures.
I am a member!
Depends on what you mean by proprietary hardware. We certainly are reliant on closed designs. Those hardware designs can't be modified or used by others. However this is a separate issue from free software. The user can't modify the hardware even had the designs been 'open'.
x86 is a problematic platform for free software enthusiasts in general though anyway. There are non-free components and no way of changing it in the near or far future.
Unfortunately the movement is way too small to make a dent here. A perfect solution would involve designing from the ground up and even then you would ultimately run into patent, speed, and similar issues. There may be some hardware which is near 100% free. At least from a free software perspective. They are not x86 though.
The netbook Stallman uses is a good example. It is far from a full fledged notebook and most users would have severe trouble with it. The screen is tiny, the system is slow, and while it generally works it's not remotely practical for day to day use unless you are Richard Stallman. Not to mention you can't actually get the thing and the newer version which is coming out won't be free software friendly.
Now there probably could be changes made to the older design that would keep it free, improve its usability, and slightly increase the speed. It still however would be far from the experience you expect from even a basic system. And after all this it wouldn't run Trisquel. However it may be possible to get a mini version of Trisquel running if Rubén had the time and resources to work on it.
Our hardware is as free as I see it getting for a while.
It's essential for people to make conscious decisions and financially support the free software ecosystem. Just because you can get it without charge doesn't mean this is in your best interest. If things are going to continue to improve and get to a point where free software can compete with major corporations more money needs to be spent on freedom leaning projects.
Regardless of if you are purchasing movies, music, software, or hardware think about who and where you get it from. Hardware is not the only problem. Digital restrictions on movies and music is another good example. We need to support companies like http://eztakes.com/. They only distribute DRM free content and while the selection is small they do have some good movies. We also need to fund and work with other projects looking to develop new quality entertainment. Bypassing the entertainment industry is critical.
I think we can do it. It may take a while though. We need to work on new advertising platforms (to replace Google's Adwords), new search engines (privacy invasive), and new entertainment sites (digital restrictions issues). Working on getting away from x86 is also something we should work on in the far future. I think this will happen only if/when/around the time GNU/Linux users make up closer to 10% of the market. This assumes consumers are going to companies that put freedom first. However even now the 2-5% of GNU/Linux users today aren't focused on purchasing from freedom leaning companies and that is the biggest problem. If every GNU/Linux user purchased only freedom friendly hardware we could probably have a completely free non-x86 solution that ran Trisquel... and even the web entertainment sites with a decent set of content.
Here are the latest man pages. I have installed them on OSX and now have
access to "complex".
http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/docs/man-pages/
I've heard of a successful solving the issue by a USB Dongle before, and I
can only recommend using a dongle, which has been confirmed as working with
the libre kernel; in other words: rather invest into working hardware, than
possibly submitting some non-working one in the category "not compatible"
within the h-node list.
I am a translator!
In order to know whether the wireless card is supported please paste output of this command:
$lspci -nnk | grep "Network controller"
I am pretty sure that the desktop packages of gNewSense, in its latest stable release, are not updated anymore. This "belief" is justified by the fact that this release was based on Ubuntu 8.04 LTS, which does not provide such updates anymore. I invite anybody who would have recently used gNewSense to confirm or infirm.
If I am right, using gNewSense does not seem such a good idea (security risks, uncorrected bugs, etc.).
Today, Trisquel is, among the free GNU/Linux distributions, the most popular (and it deserves it!). Parabola seems to gain many users too but requires quite some experience in administrating GNU/Linux (and the wish to spend time to do so).
The latest Trisquel (5.5 Brigantia) uses a rather recent Linux-libre kernel (version 3.0)... but it may not drive your Wifi card because many manufacturers do not distribute their firmwares under a Free license (they are blobs in the Linux kernels that are removed by the Linux-libre project). Taking a look at the output of 'lspci' allows to identify the Wifi chipset and search the Web for free drivers and firmwares... but without much hope (most free drivers already are in Linux-libre).
If no free solution can drive your Wifi card, the recommended solution is to acquire a freedom-friendly replacement. ThinkPenguin is an excellent place where to buy such hardware since a) it is *guaranteed* to perfectly work with Linux-libre (hence Trisquel) and b) by using this link (the "libre" part of the URL is important), 25% of the benefits made on your purchase are donated to the Trisquel project.
Thanks for the ping back.
Here is the link to the Linux Libre laptop.
https://www.thinkpenguin.com/gnu-linux/penguin-libre-gnu-linux-notebook
There's information on how to install, a reverse engineered b43 driver on gNewSense.
However, the git clone command:
git clone git://git.bues.ch/b43-tools.git
Comes back with "fatal: read error: Connection reset by peer".
http://www.gnewsense.org/Documentation/Wireless
The network adaptor is BroadCom 43... (output from lspci)
If I can get gNewSense working with wifi, then I should be able to get it working in Trisquel.
As I'm currently, and forever working in the voluntary sector, I cannot really afford to change hardware. I'm hoping that the Macbook (late 2007) will just keep on working, without planned obsolescence.
Many thanks :-)
If there is a free driver and firmware for your Wifi card, then it probably is in the recent versions of Linux-libre... and it is easier to update to the latest stable version of this kernel (Linux-libre 3.3.3) using this repository... or to directly switch to Trisquel 5.5 Brigantia, which has quite a recent kernel (Linux-libre 3.0.0).
If there is a free driver and firmware for your Wifi card, then it probably
is in the recent versions of Linux-libre... and it is easier to update to the
latest stable version of this kernel (Linux-libre 3.3.3) using this
repository... or to directly switch to Trisquel 5.5 Brigantia, which has
quite a recent kernel (Linux-libre 3.0.0).
I would highly advise you to install Trisquel instead of gNewSense. If you are trying to be like RMS (because he has gNewSense) I would advise you against it in this case.
The reason RMS uses gNewSense is because he has a lemote laptop which contains a non x86 (MIPS I believe) architecture. Trisquel does not have a MIPS version so he can't install it on his computer.
However, gNewSense is based off Ubuntu 8.04 I think which is from 2008. The current version of Trisquel is based off Ubuntu 11.10 which is from the end of 2011 so it is much more up to date. Since broadcom free'd it's drivers after 2008 it is more likely Trisquel will just work out of the box then gNewSense.
It is hard to say though if your card will work because some of the 43xx series work and some don't according to h-node. I would download the latest 5.5 CD and try it.
But yeah I wouldn't use gNewSense unless you have a specific reason like RMS with the computer architecture. RMS and the GNU project have given Trisquel their blessing so there is no reason to think gNewSense is superior to Trisquel in any sort of ethical/free software fashion. They are both free distros.
A link to Michal Maslowski's post can be found here. For some reason it is not showing up properly on the forums.
According to this article he uses the Leemote because it is the only laptop available with a free BIOS.
As far as the latest version being based off 8.04 I was referring to the latest official version (i.e. non-beta). I was referring back to the OP at this part and not talking about RMS. I was assuming the OP wasn't running the 3.0 beta but latest 2.3 release.
You are right about the firmware. I didn't know as I don't use that kind of wireless card. I just remembered reading an article about it but when you posted that I looked further and read about the non-free firmware. Thank you for pointing that out.
Also I was unaware the Parabola works on the Yeelong. According to that article I linked to it says "gNewSense is the only totally free distribution that will run on the Lemote, which has a MIPS-like processor, he (RMS) says." I was unaware of that fact.
I am a member!
Not to nitpick although I think this isn't quite accurate. I believe the Lemote doesn't have a BIOS. It isn't that it has a free BIOS. Some of the hardware may be non-free. I know the newer one has a non-free 3d accelerated graphics chipset for instance.
I think there is a bit of incorrect information being spread by all of us in regards to some of the details about what RMS uses, it's exact status freedom wise, the distributions you can run on it, the reasons RMS uses it, and so forth.
Our systems are probably reliant on the least non-free software for instance although are technically not 100% free. The BIOS and non-free microcode primarily. Though unlike the laptops which have had a free BIOS ours aren't reliant on other components which need non-free drivers. Thus distributions like Trisquel are fully supported. But- again- you have to look at it in relation to what is available and currently feasible. There are at least some tradeoffs being made by everyone across the board.
Ultimately we would like to ship a system with a free BIOS although porting coreboot (free BIOS) is a non-trivial task. It isn't cheap. The other thing is the BIOS is not the big problem everybody thinks it is. At least there is a bigger problem getting to a 100% free system. Microcode exists which is a bigger problem to overcome. I'm no expert in this and neither is Richard Stallman.
The best person to explain this I believe is one of the coreboot developers. I spoke with the lead developer a few years ago on these issues during a conference. At least I think it was the lead developer I spoke with (memory might be failing here). I know it was one of the core developers at a minimum for that project.
> Not to nitpick although I think this isn't quite accurate. I believe
> the Lemote doesn't have a BIOS. It isn't that it has a free BIOS.
It has a free program that initializes the hardware, shows a menu of
kernels to run and boots one of them, supports network booting and
flashing itself. It's not compatible with x86 BIOSes and is more
powerful (when using an ext2 boot partition there is no need for grub).
The program is called PMON and such programs are sometimes referred to
as boot firmware (this name would be confusing here).
> I know the newer one has a non-free
> 3d accelerated graphics chipset for instance.
It's not available yet, the chipset might be a problem. Although even
without 2d or 3d acceleration it could be better than SMI712 used in
current YeeLoongs.
I am a member!
Good to know. That is about what I figured. It isn't using coreboot or a non-free BIOS. Obviously there is something present prior to the OS (although maybe I worded it badly). I think there is something which distinguishes the BIOS in x86 systems with the firmware here. I know there is a lot of legacy stuff left over from the days of DOS.
I am a member!
Not to nitpick although I think this isn't quite accurate. I believe the
Lemote doesn't have a BIOS. It isn't that it has a free BIOS. Some of the
hardware may be non-free. I know the newer one has a non-free 3d accelerated
graphics chipset for instance.
I think there is a bit of incorrect information being spread by all of us in
regards to some of the details about what RMS uses, it's exact status freedom
wise, the distributions you can run on it, the reasons RMS uses it, and so
forth.
Our systems are probably reliant on the least non-free software for instance
although are technically not 100% free. The BIOS and non-free microcode
primarily. Though unlike the laptops which have had a free BIOS ours aren't
reliant on other components which need non-free drivers. Thus distributions
like Trisquel are fully supported. But- again- you have to look at it in
relation to what is available and currently feasible. There are at least some
tradeoffs being made by everyone across the board.
Ultimately we would like to ship a system with a free BIOS although porting
coreboot (free BIOS) is a non-trivial task. It isn't cheap. The other thing
is the BIOS is not the big problem everybody thinks it is. At least there is
a bigger problem getting to a 100% free system. Microcode exists which is a
bigger problem to overcome. I'm no expert in this and neither is Richard
Stallman.
The best person to explain this I believe is one of the coreboot developers.
I spoke with the lead developer a few years ago on these issues during a
conference. At least I think he was the lead developer. I know it was one of
the core developers at least working on the project.
A link to Michal Maslowski's post can be found
[http://listas.trisquel.info/pipermail/trisquel-users/2012-April/008800.html
here]. For some reason it is not showing up properly on the forums.
According to
[https://www.networkworld.com/news/2011/031411-richard-stallman.html?page=2
this article] he uses the Leemote because it is the only laptop available
with a free BIOS.
As far as the latest version being based off 8.04 I was referring to the
latest official version (i.e. non-beta). I was referring back to the OP at
this part and not talking about RMS. I was assuming the OP wasn't running
the 3.0 beta but latest 2.3 release.
You are right about the firmware. I didn't know as I don't use that kind of
wireless card. I just remembered reading an article about it but when you
posted that I looked further and read about the non-free firmware. Thank you
for pointing that out.
Also I was unaware the Parabola works on the Yeelong. According to that
article I linked to it says "gNewSense is the only totally free distribution
that will run on the Lemote, which has a MIPS-like processor, he (RMS) says."
I was unaware of that fact.
I would highly advise you to install Trisquel instead of gNewSense. If you
are trying to be like RMS (because he has gNewSense) I would advise you
against it in this case.
The reason RMS uses gNewSense is because he has a
[http://stallman.org/stallman-computing.html lemote laptop] which contains a
non x86 (MIPS I believe) architecture. Trisquel does not have a MIPS
version so he can't install it on his computer.
However, gNewSense is based off Ubuntu 8.04 I think which is from 2008. The
current version of Trisquel is based off Ubuntu 11.10 which is from the end
of 2011 so it is much more up to date. Since broadcom free'd it's drivers
after 2008 it is more likely Trisquel will just work out of the box then
gNewSense.
It is hard to say though if your card will work because some of the 43xx
series work and some don't according to
[http://www.h-node.org/wifi/catalogue/en/1/1/Broadcom/undef/undef/undef/undef/undef
h-node]. I would download the latest 5.5 CD and try it.
But yeah I wouldn't use gNewSense unless you have a specific reason like RMS
with the computer architecture. RMS and the GNU project have given Trisquel
their blessing so there is no reason to think gNewSense is superior to
Trisquel in any sort of ethical/free software fashion. They are both free
distros.
Thanks for the ping back.
Here is the link to the Linux Libre laptop.
https://www.thinkpenguin.com/gnu-linux/penguin-libre-gnu-linux-notebook
There's information on how to install, a reverse engineered b43 driver on gNewSense.
However, the git clone command:
git clone git://git.bues.ch/b43-tools.git
Comes back with "fatal: read error: Connection reset by peer".
http://www.gnewsense.org/Documentation/Wireless
The network adaptor is BroadCom 43... (output from lspci)
If I can get gNewSense working with wifi, then I should be able to get it working in Trisquel.
As I'm currently, and forever working in the voluntary sector, I cannot really afford to change hardware. I'm hoping that the Macbook (late 2007) will just keep on working, without planned obsolescence.
Many thanks :-)
Thanks for the ping back.
Here is the link to the Linux Libre laptop.
https://www.thinkpenguin.com/gnu-linux/penguin-libre-gnu-linux-notebook
There's information on how to install, a reverse engineered b43 driver on
gNewSense.
However, the git clone command:
git clone git://git.bues.ch/b43-tools.git
Comes back with "fatal: read error: Connection reset by peer".
http://www.gnewsense.org/Documentation/Wireless
The network adaptor is BroadCom 43... (output from lspci)
If I can get gNewSense working with wifi, then I should be able to get it
working in Trisquel.
As I'm currently, and forever working in the voluntary sector, I cannot
really afford to change hardware. I'm hoping that the Macbook (late 2007)
will just keep on working, without planned obsolescence.
Many thanks :-)
Thanks for the ping back.
Here is the link to the Linux Libre laptop.
https://www.thinkpenguin.com/gnu-linux/penguin-libre-gnu-linux-notebook
There's information on how to install, a reverse engineered b43 driver on
gNewSense.
However, the git clone command:
git clone git://git.bues.ch/b43-tools.git
Comes back with "fatal: read error: Connection reset by peer".
http://www.gnewsense.org/Documentation/Wireless
The network adaptor is BroadCom 43... (output from lspci)
If I can get gNewSense working with wifi, then I should be able to get it
working in Trisquel.
As I'm currently, and forever working in the voluntary sector, I cannot
really afford to change hardware. I'm hoping that the Macbook (late 2007)
will just keep on working, without planned obsolescence.
Many thanks :-)
If you use
make menuconfig
instead of
make xconfig
you won't require the QT libraries.
I build and install new kernels with the following steps:
-
tar xf linux-libre*.tar.gz
-
cd linux-*
-
make menuconfig
-
INSTALL_MOD_STRIP=1 make deb-pkg
-
cd ..
-
sudo dpkg -i linux*.deb
If you keep a standard configuration, why not simply using this repository to always use the latest Linux-libre kernel?
Use "make help" to list all of the possible configuration targets.
I have installed Trisquel 5.5 (the 700MB download), however, it doesn't come with any "make" or "gcc" developer commands.
The openfwwf driver didn't pick up the BroadCom 4321 hardware, so I couldn't use wifi.
Somebody recommended checking out the h-node site, to find linux libre compatible hardware.
I found this wifi USB dongle, which I could potentially use, as a workaround.
http://tinyurl.com/d8xx377
Is it worth installing the BroadCom proprietary driver as a workaround? What would be the easiest way?
I am moving house in 3 days, and the new place has got a router. Which I could plug into with an ethernet cable.
One thing I noticed on gNewSense, what that all development tools were preinstalled. There were also entries in "info" and "man" for understanding complex numbers (possibly there were vector entries as well).
Does anybody know how to install the most complete "info" and "man" documentation?
I am a member!
Nobody here is going to recommend installation of a non-free driver/firmware
or help you with it. The primary benefit of Trisquel is freedom. If you are
really following the free software philosophically rather than the "open
source" philosophy the non-free "option" isn't an option. If you are going to
go this route there are other distributions you would go to instead. Most
distributions are largely free although problematic for technical (and
ethical) reasons related to non-free software.
Trisquel's technical benefit would be it doesn't include these non-free
components so you know where at least some problems will likely arise going
forward had you chosen a non-free distribution (particularly in relation to
support for hardware- although as Adobe and Oracle have shown this applies to
critical software components too). In any case Trisquel makes it easy to
select the right stuff the first time around.
I agree with you Chris.
What about a FaiF hardware platform? The Think Penguin Linux Libre platform contains proprietary hardware?
I understand the implications of not running or understanding FaiF software and hardware. The information war is set to continue into the BioTech and NanoTech futures.
I am a member!
Depends on what you mean by proprietary hardware. We certainly are reliant on
closed designs. Those hardware designs can't be modified or used by others.
However this is a separate issue from free software. The user can't modify
the hardware even had the designs been 'open'.
x86 is a problematic platform for free software enthusiasts in general though
anyway. There are non-free components and no way of changing it in the near
or far future.
Unfortunately the movement is way too small to make a dent here. A perfect
solution would involve designing from the ground up and even then you would
ultimately run into patent, speed, and similar issues. There may be some
hardware which is near 100% free. At least from a free software perspective.
They are not x86 though.
The netbook Stallman uses is a good example. It is far from a full fledged
notebook and most users would have severe trouble with it. The screen is
tiny, the system is slow, and while it generally works it's not remotely
practical for day to day use unless you are Richard Stallman. Not to mention
you can't actually get the thing and the newer version which is coming out
won't be free software friendly.
Now there probably could be changes made to the older design that would keep
it free, improve its usability, and slightly increase the speed. It still
however would be far from the experience you expect from even a basic system.
And after all this it wouldn't run Trisquel. However it may be possible to
get a mini version of Trisquel running if Rubén had the time and resources
to work on it.
Our hardware is as free as I see it getting for a while.
It's essential for people to make conscious decisions and financially support
the free software ecosystem. Just because you can get it without charge
doesn't mean this is in your best interest. If things are going to continue
to improve and get to a point where free software can compete with major
corporations more money needs to be spent on freedom leaning projects.
Regardless of if you are purchasing movies, music, software, or hardware
think about who and where you get it from. Hardware is not the only problem.
Digital restrictions on movies and music is another good example. We need to
support companies like http://eztakes.com/. They only distribute DRM free
content and while the selection is small they do have some good movies. We
also need to fund and work with other projects looking to develop new quality
entertainment. Bypassing the entertainment industry is critical.
I think we can do it. It may take a while though. We need to work new
advertising platforms (to replace Google's Adwords), new search engines
(privacy invasive), and new entertainment sites (digital restrictions
issues). Working on getting away from x86 is also something we should work on
in the far future. I think this will happen only if/when/around the time
GNU/Linux users make up closer to 10% of the market. This assumes consumers
are going to companies that put freedom first. However even now the 2-5% of
GNU/Linux users today aren't focused on purchasing from freedom leaning
companies and that is the biggest problem. If every GNU/Linux user purchased
only freedom friendly hardware we could probably have a completely free
non-x86 solution that ran Trisquel... and even the web entertainment sites
with a decent set of content.
Here are the latest man pages. I have installed them on OSX and now have access to "complex".
http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/docs/man-pages/
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