Moving from Ubuntu to fully Free Distro's
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Hello GNU/Linux guru's :-)
I been using GNU/Linux systems for about a little more than 2 years now. I tend to be a slow learner. But have become fairly comfortable in the command line (as long as its not compiling from source) and have been completely free from Windows for about 1 year now. And now, after learning that Ubuntu has non-free parts included by default. I wish to move over to a fully free by default Distro and go further on the road of Free Software.
But upon trying the Trisquel Live image on a USB, I found a few things that I couldn't do that I am accustomed to on Ubuntu installs. I was hoping I could make a list of my daily / general computing needs here. And slowly learn to replace , modify, work around, or just manually add the the applications in which I use to do those things. Sorry if this list gets long, I plan to add to it over time as obstacles arise.
- First priority is that for my occupation, I need to use flash for various sites they require. I LOVE the fact that Gnash was included by default. But I tried using it on an Ubuntu machine about 8 months ago, and it barely played Youtube videos. And while now I only use Mnitube or Keepvic.com to view Youtube vids. I do still need to use flash for my occupation on video sites that don't support streaming (Minitube) or can be downloaded with Keepvid.com. Is there a way to make Gnash work well (not perfect, but good enough to be viewable) on all flash video sites?
- Second, I tried to install the Ubuntu One syncing service. But didn't find it in the included repos, and adding the Ubuntu One PPA didn't seem to include all the dependencies and refused to install. Is this cause of non-free parts used in the program? Or just a trademark reason that doesn't permit Canonical Products to be installable (from PPA) on non officials distributions? If installation of Ubuntu One is not possible I would be willing to switch to a fully Free alternative, but I don't have the hardware or knowledge to set up an ownCloud server. So I would need something that is hosted already. Eventually I would like to have a home server. But will have to be placed on hold for now.
Mkay that's all for now lol Sorry for long explanations, I tend to be more long winded than necessary. :-)
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On 07/10/2012 10:14 AM, name at domain wrote:
> Hello GNU/Linux guru's :-)
>
> I been using GNU/Linux systems for about a little more than 2 years
now.[...]
>
> But upon trying the Trisquel Live image on a USB, I found a few things
that I couldn't do that I am accustomed to on Ubuntu installs. I was
hoping I could make a list of my daily / general computing needs here.
And slowly learn to replace , modify, work around, or just manually add
the the applications in which I use to do those things. Sorry if this
list gets long, I plan to add to it over time as obstacles arise.
>
> [...]
(Can't help with the Flash part in your request)
> Second, I tried to install the Ubuntu One syncing service. [...] If installation of Ubuntu One is not
possible I would be willing to switch to a fully Free alternative, but I
don't have the hardware or knowledge to set up an ownCloud server. So I
would need something that is hosted already. Eventually I would like to
have a home server. But will have to be placed on hold for now. [..]
Ubuntu One's server is not "free as in freedom" and I doubt anyone here
will help install the client on Trisquel. Cutting the dependence on such
non-free services and reaching autonomy is another path to running free
software in as many situations as possible. I am glad you noticed/asked
about Ubuntu One. This article may help learn a bit more about why it's
an important subject:
http://autonomo.us/2008/07/14/franklin-street-statement/
There is a growing list of OwnCloud providers.
Make sure the one you choose has version 4.04, many bugs have been
fixed. Portknox seems promising. As always, keep good backups and be
careful with the data you trust 3rd parties with. I encourage you to try
and setup your own OwnCloud, it's not that hard. I used Dreamhost and
here are my notes:
http://wiki.dreamhost.com/OwnCloud
One huge advantage of having your own is you can essentially have
unlimited storage, well, limited only by your financial means and
equipment :)
By all means come back and share your findings.
Cheers,
Fabian Rodriguez
http://trisquel.magicfab.ca
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I looked for a little bit today and couldn't seem to find any hosted ownCloud services. But only looked on DuckDuckGo, so possibly have needed to search others as well. I have to head to work here in a little bit. (late shift) But I'm actually gonna try and work hard for the next couple days to learn how to get ownCloud up and running. And maybe use OpenDNS to make it acessable to the outside world for when I'm away from home. I'll do it before doing a fresh install, so I'll have learned the first time and can set it up again after the reinstall. Need to learn how to forward ports though. Never done that before and tutorials have been really confusing :-P
But is is that safe / secure to have on my main machine if it will be viewable to outside my house? Or is the password protection secure enough to keep the rest of my machine protected?
I'm gonna go through your notes tonight after work, if I don't pass out that is. Thank you for working so hard on that documentation!
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On 07/10/2012 02:01 PM, name at domain wrote:
> I looked for a little bit today and couldn't seem to find any hosted ownCloud services. But only looked
on DuckDuckGo, so possibly have needed to search others as well. I have
to head to work here in a little bit. (late shift) But I'm actually
gonna try and work hard for the next couple days to learn how to get
ownCloud up and running. And maybe use OpenDNS to make it acessable to
the outside world for when I'm away from home. I'll do it before doing a
fresh install, so I'll have learned the first time and can set it up
again after the reinstall. Need to learn how to forward ports though.
Never done that before and tutorials have been really confusing :-P
Maybe check http://pagekite.net/ carefully, it seems to do what you
describe. It's also published under a free license (AGPLv3):
http://pagekite.net/wiki/Floss/License/
>
> But is is that safe / secure to have on my main machine if it will be
viewable to outside my house? Or is the password protection secure
enough to keep the rest of my machine protected?
Maybe create a virtual machine dedicated to that.
>
> I'm gonna go through your notes tonight after work, if I don't pass
out that is. Thank you for working so hard on that documentation!
There are good community resources for OwnCloud, don't hesitate to use
them too :)
Cheers,
Fabian Rodriguez
http://trisquel.magicfab.ca
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Sorry for the long delay. Been really busy lol. But I was gonna make the plunge and try and setup ownCloud on my CR-48 with Trisquel mini installed. The whole "Learn by doing" approach. :-)
But on the first step, It came back saying it was unable to locate 3 packages: php-xml, php-mbstring and php5-zip.
Are these not included by default in Trisquel?
I tried looking for a PPA to add to satisfy these, and I tried "ppa:ubuntu-it-dev/ppa" because there was actually a owncloud package in that repo. So was hoping it could also satisfy my missing dependencies. But nope :-( Still came back with same missing ones. And 2 new errorrs
Regex compilation error - unmatched [ or [^
and
Couldn't find any package by regex 'B'
Did you have to add any PPA when doing your setup?
$ sudo apt-get install owncloud
THANK YOU! I thought it was there cause of the PPA I added. But removed that and still was there, so guess should have checked that first lol.
Its just I was following the instructions on the ownCloud site and it was having me do a really long command that installed like 15 packages, and 5 of them weren't being found. So does this mean that I no longer need to worry about those other packages the ownCloud site was calling for?
Also, I don't see it in my app list, and synaptic isn't finding it. So I assume it must be run from the command line right?
Unless you are still using Trisquel 4.0 Taranis, the "owncloud" (spelled like this) package *is* listed by Synaptic. As a consequence, it can easily be installed through it.
Sorry getting my application names mixed up. I meant Synapse. The Gnome Do like launcher.
Is ownCloud launched from the terminal? And after that, what local address do I need to go to on my browser in order to see it and login? I assume it will ask me for a new admin password and username?
Sorry for hammering ya with questions. Just don't wanna miss anything lol
**Edit** I should have been reading the replies more closely lol I didn't realize @lembas and @SirGrant also made new replies to that, and sort of addressed the question. I'll give they're suggestions a shot. :-)
>Also, I don't see it in my app list, and synaptic isn't finding it. So I assume it must be run from the command line right?
I don't understand that part about synaptic but ignoring that, you can type
dpkg -L owncloud|grep /bin/
to see the binaries installed by the package. Try running those.
Sometimes the menu item isn't properly installed unless you logout and login again. (This could be a quirk on my admittedly much abused system...)
And you can make a menu item yourself if it doesn't appear once you figure out which binary you want to run.
the owncloud directory didn't have any bin. but I found a file called owncloud.php in /usr/share/owncloud/webdav/.
Could that be the launcher for it? I have no idea how to get it to run though. :-/
Yes, I should have asked. What version of Trisquel are you running? As Magic Banana mentioned the package is not in 4.0. All other supported versions should have it.
Latest Mini version. 5.5 I believe. But got my applications mixed up. I meant Synapse and not synaptic lol.
would ownCloud normally show up in the application menu list? or as @lembas said, do I need to search for the ownCloud folder, then look for the executable binary I would need?
I actually just went to localhost/owncloud and it was the startup page. Does that mean its starts automatically when the computer logs in? Or is that just an HTML page that is loaded, and the server itself isn't actually running yet? And if so, how do we set the Startup Applications in Trisquel? In most other distros it was easy as there was a simple app named "Startup Applcations" and playing with that taught me alot about launching apps from terminal.
I did my best to fill in the info, but wasn't sure about somethings.
I got the below error message when I submitted it, the ***** is where I think it was actually displaying my passwords I had set. Not sure, but wanted to be safe just in case:
DB Error: "You have an error in your SQL syntax; check the manual that corresponds to your MySQL server version for the right syntax to use near '*****`d+1`.W5Q/I' at line 1"
Offending command was: CREATE USER 'owncloud'@'localhost' IDENTIFIED BY '`*****DB Error: "You have an error in your SQL syntax; check the manual that corresponds to your MySQL server version for the right syntax to use near *****d+1`.W5Q/I' at line 1"
Offending command was: CREATE USER 'owncloud'@'%' IDENTIFIED BY '*****DB2 Error: connect failed: _doConnect: [Error message: Access denied for user 'owncloud'@'localhost' (using password: YES)] [Native code: 1045] [Native message: Access denied for user 'owncloud'@'localhost' (using password: YES)]
Can you see anything that might indicate what's wrong?
P.S. I did make an account over at PortKnox.net. Is that a hosted ownCloud site you would personally trust?
The Apache Web server is running (I know it is Apache server because it is the one in dependence of the owncloud package). Because it is a server, it should run even if your user is not logged in, i.e., it is a system component. You can start/stop/restart/status it with:
$ sudo service apache2 start | stop | restart | status
Awesome, tested it and stopping it does indead make the page not show up in my browser at https://localhost/owncloud. Though a possible big problem is that when trying to check "Force SSL" it has a "Test SSL" link beside it so you can see if it will work with your setup. But mine won't load :-( Is this because of missing dependencies or is it a setting in Apache itself?
Also, on the start up page, it asks to create user names and passwords for 3 different users it seems (All words case letters are exactly as on the strart up page.)
Administrator User
database user (already has owncloud typed in for the user name)
administrative user (already has "root" typed in for the user name)
Are the Administrator User and administrative user the same person? Or is the administrative user the same as the root user on my system, and I should use the same password as root on my system? Oooh and was that error message caused by me not having the right things filled out?
I am gonna be taking notes on everything so that I can refer back to them and on bug and annoy you guys if I forget some things later. :-P
Again, I have never installed owncloud and you had better read some documentation. However I believe that, for security reasons, every component (the Web server, the database and owncloud itself) are run by different users. But you can certainly have the same password for each of them.
Yea, Its just seems hard to find specific and beginner documentation or tutorials. I actually have an account on the Portknox ownCloud service setup for now. But its a bit slow. So still hope to set up my own eventually.
I Tried actually having it set up as different users, and each with they're own password. But it still game me a different kind of error. Though I was using really long (150+ char) passwords for them. Cause I use KeepassX. :-) So that may have caused some issues. I'll keep playing with it though.
Thank ya for all the help though!!
Oh sorry, I forgot about the KeepassX password manager and I didn't know that there was no option to edit a post once its made. I only tried apt-get keepassx from the terminal and it didn't work.
Also, are all the games in the Ubuntu Software Center, that are GPL'd that is, available in Trisquel? or would they require an adding of a PPA?
Last one I think is Java. OpenJDK has been working perfectly for me for a long time. I didn't think to try it when I had the Live image booted. But is OpenJDK completely Free and Libre?
P.S. no big deal as I've already made the first post and can't edit it now. But why is wiki formatting available to comments here, but not to the creator of a thread?
1) KeepassX is available in the repositories.
2) here is a list of games available for Trisquel via the repsoitories
3) OpenJDK is also in the repos.
4) The first post can be done using wiki. When you make a post you have to select "wiki" by clicking on input format and selecting the proper radio button. Otherwise I believe it defaults to HTML.
Thank you sir! :) I'll try the Live USB again tonight and search the repos for those again. Maybe even do a test install with my second machine (unlocked CR-48 Chromebook) Wanna make sure I got all the differences down pat before making the switch. Not nearly as difficult as switching from Windows to Ubuntu 9.10 back 2 years ago. But still just as important of a switch. :-)
Bout the formatting. I ask bout the formatting cause the input format option wasn't there when I made the first post to start the thread. But upon making the first comment, the option was there. Could this be a bug? I mainly noticed cause I was wanting to add a couple links, but wasn't sure how to do it in HTML. I looked at the formatting help page, but didn't see bout links in HTML, only in wiki. But it was odd that I also didn't see the bullet list in the wiki part, but did see it in the HTML. Is there a larger page with a more in depth description of formatting options?
I read your problems mate. and I would like to bring your attention that trisquel is a 100% free gnu/linux distribution.. and it includes no non-free packages or binary-only blobs in the kernel unlike Ubuntu....and we don't recommend in using those..Regarding flash, as you are already aware that flash is a proprietary format.. Gnash these days work well with Youtube, Facebook and some sites. .. but there are some sites which use the AVM2 format which gnash has no support as yet.. Regarding the Ubuntu One Cloud.. well it is not included because the server side is proprietary while the client is gpl'd... hope that answers... last i would like to say, if a little sacrifice is worth having your freedom.. one must do it, aint it??
I know this is probably obvious to you, but having your HOME directory on a separate partition is really really helpful. The OS installers will leave it alone if you switch from Ubuntu to Trisquel and vise versa and since Trisquel is based off of Ubuntu, there shouldn't be too much of an issue with settings. For example, if you used Firefox on Ubuntu and use Trisquel's Abrowser, your settings will be the same due to Abrowser being based off of Firefox.
Since I do development, I have files in my own HOME directory and a public_html folder for nginx to use on the HOME partition. Since some .conf files are referenced in /etc/nginx, I simply moved those to a /conf/ folder in public_html and created symbolic links in /etc/nginx to them.
Other non-Debian based distros like Fedora/CentOS, SuSE, and Slackware can use the separate HOME partition, but I haven't really used them and not sure if the settings stored there can be easily referenced with Trisquel.
I know this may or may not be important, but if you are switching from Ubuntu, isn't it best to have the versions sync up to avoid issues with the settings? I ask because I assume moving from Ubuntu 11.10 to Trisquel 5.5 would be ok since they share the same codebase, but moving from Ubuntu 12.04 to 5.5 would maybe create issues.
Its too bad there are no Trisquel 6.0 ISOs if he is moving from Ubuntu 12.04 to ease the transition.
LOL the separate Home partition is actually one of my other reasons for wanting to do a fresh install as well. Would you know of any easy to understand, yet modern guides for doing this? I have read a few books that described doing it on RedHat 2 or 3 I think. But they were from way way back when 1 GB of Hard Drive space was considered massive. So a modern look at the topic would help alot. :-D I did watch an episode of Linux Action Show that gave a pretty good tutorial about how to go about it. But I have no idea how to do a fresh install (on a system that already has the separate HOME partition in place) while keeping all my apps and their settings. Though Ubuntu Tweak seems like it can help with that.
And Thank you @MagicFab for mentioning the ownCloud services! I was wondering if there were some, but didn't know where to look, or if they would even "advertise" about that being a benefit / feature. I'll check around and get back with ya. :-)
@icarious, Yup, I started out in GNU/Linux before I even knew what it was. A really old laptop I had stopped recognizing the CD/DVD drive and after a short couple searches, some how stumbled upon installing Ubuntu. All I knew back then, in the days of 9.04, was that it was sooooo customizable, and that is was free as is price. And it made that Laptop work like new again. So I fell in love with it. And its been a journey of growing and learning ever since. :-)
And as far as I know, I don't have any reliance on any 12.04. But I'll let you guys know if I find any problems.
God Bless ya's and Thank you! I'll check back with progress.
I am a member!
The installer for Ubuntu-like distros makes the setting of a separate
home part pretty easy. For instance, in Trisquel 5.5, one of your
partitioning options is "something else", which will let you manually
size, add, delete, format, ... My latest reinstall of Trisquel 5.5
allocated 10 gb for the root filesystem, 4 gb for swap, and the
remaining space for /home. If you think, for instance, /var may get
extra-big, it might be a good idea to choose the manual option and make
/ bigger, which would make /home a little smaller.
-Dave
On 07/10/2012 11:42 AM, name at domain wrote:
> LOL the separate Home partition is actually one of my other reasons for
> wanting to do a fresh install as well.
>I have no idea how to do a fresh install (on a system that already has the separate HOME partition in place)
I think this is how it's done, first make a listing of your packages
dpkg --get-selections > my_packages
Then obviously save the my_packages file remotely so it is safe. Then take a look at your current (non-volatile) partitions with
mount -t noproc,sysfs,fusectl,debugfs,securityfs,devtmpfs,tmpfs,devpts,fuse.gvfs-fuse-daemon
and take notice of the location and type of your partitions (e.g. /dev/sdb3 and ext4).
Pop in a Trisquel installation media and reboot to start the install. At the partitioning stage choose manual partitioning and assign the old home the role of the new home and select the same file system it used to have. The trick is to _not_ select the home partition to be formatted, unlike other partitions. (swap partitions can't be formatted, you might also want to preserve other partitions, depending on your setup)
Once the new system is up and running (lo and behold, it remembered your old background image!) you'll want to run
dpkg --clear-selections
dpkg --set-selections < my_packages
apt-get dselect-upgrade
That's it. Old packages, old configs, new other partitions.
Did I manage to be confusing enough?
I am a member!
:) I think you are one of the few people who actually have a system that mostly works (all?) with Trisquel. Hopefully your other hardware does too (printers, etc).
I see you aren't an associate member yet. I thought I'd welcome you to this community and let you know where the project stands. The project is largely supported by a handful of people. One of them being Rubén Rodríguez (the lead developer). There are others though who make this distribution possible (such as the maintainer of the libre-linux kernel, GNash/Lightspark developer(s), and others).
All of these people are donating there time to make this distribution and other free distributions possible. From the sounds of it you are already aware that free doesn't mean no cost. It would be greatly appreciated if you too could contribute to the project in whatever way you can. Most people don't have too many options although one thing just about everybody can do is make a financial contribution of some sort.
You can for instance become an associate member:
http://trisquel.info/en/member
Make a one time donation:
http://trisquel.info/en/donate
There is a goal to hit 100 associate members. We missed the goal of January a long time back although are still hoping to achieve it eventually. For most people this is a good way to make a considerable contribution in a way that isn't terribly taxing or a burden. Your contribution is spread out and thus easier to manage.
There are other little ways to contribute too.
The Trisquel gift store (mugs, shirts, and similar items):
And ThinkPenguin (the company I run which focuses on freedom friendly hardware) also contributes back 25% of the profits when orders are placed from:
Sorry took so long to reply to your specific comment. Its been busy round home lately and finally getting some extra time to try and work more on moving to Trisquel. :-)
I have been unemployed for almost 3 years. Now finally have a part time job, as well as building a home based business. So as of right now, I don't have extra to donate. But as things progress I want to begin monthly subscription donations to the Distro I do finally settle on. I first tried gNewSense, and really loved how it was still on the Gnome 2.x interface, but it hasn't been update in a long time So in the beginning I will probably stick with Trisquel for its active development and friendly and knowledgeable forum. But later as things are no longer tight financially, I plan to also do monthly subscriptions to gNewSense and hope to spur its development as well, the Free Software Foundation, the GIMP, Blender, various free games I like, as well as the best free Video chatting option I can find. Also plan to at least get a "ALL In ONE" printer and a wireless router from the people at thinkpenguin.com. Maybe a HTPC too. :-)
I am a firm believer that anyone who has the means to financially support a free project. Should. Especially if they use it themselves. Other wise the gratis / zero price aspect, becomes much more important to you than the Freedom aspect.
I am a translator!
Some flash websites (e.g. YouTube, DailyMotion) work with a video player plugin (e.g. Totem, MPlayer) using the Greasemonkey script Linterna Mágica and a supported browser (Mozilla based, Midori, Epiphany) :
http://linterna-magica.nongnu.org/
For example, if you wish to use the Totem plugin via Midori install the packages "midori" and "totem-mozilla" (without quotes), enable user addons in the preferences of Midori and install the Linterna Mágica script by visiting the aforementioned site using Midori.
В 13:21 +0200 на 11.07.2012 (ср), name at domain написа:
> "totem-mozilla" (without quotes),
Can be skipped. It is included by default in Trisquel (not sure for
mini), because some core packages like gnome, totem, trisquel* etc.
(apt-cache rdepends totem-mozilla) depend on it.
I am a translator!
Trisquel mini ships with GNOME MPlayer and Midori instead of Totem and Abrowser (Mozilla browser) respectively, so one of the two packages "midori" and"totem-mozilla" isn't installed by default in Trisquel and Trisquel mini. Also, installing an already installed package doesn't cause any harm :)
I am a member!
Installing from Source
Installing from source is quite easy. I recently installed Apache 2.2 and PHP 5.2 from source. (It just took some time for me to get the correct Apache and PHP versions combination.)
All you do is place the folder with the source code in /usr/local/src.
In the source folder, check if there is an executable called configure or config, then type the following at the terminal inside the source folder:
$ ./configure
When that is done, type:
$ make
Then:
$ make install
>$ make install
Actually # make install i.e., need to be root.
Also, dependencies need to be met but the script will tell you what is missing if anything, in a more or less cryptic way. Usually problems hunting dependencies come from the different package names between distros or the packages not being available or being too old to satisfy the requirements. In such cases one needs to first compile the dependencies. (And their dependencies...)
But often it is indeed as simple as inputting those three commands.
Thank you guys for that!. I don't know if I'll need to install things from source yet. But I'll definitely refer back to this for pointers. :-)
For youtube videos I use a very simple bash script that plays locally in mplayer using youtube-dl:
###########
#!/bin/bash
ytdlbin="/usr/bin/youtube-dl"
ytdlopts="-g "
mplayer `$ytdlbin $ytdlopts "$*"` &> /dev/null
###########
All you have to do is ' ./script.sh "http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=videocode" '. Browser addons would bug on me and not load the video sometimes. Youtube-dl only works with youtube though. For other websites you could check cclive and modify the script but have not tried it myself since I only use youtube.
Just seen your reply. :-) I've been using Minitube and VLC ( just typing in a terminal vlc "and then the youtube url" ) and they've worked great for a long time. But recently VLC has stopped having sound. The video usually plays, but without audio. And Minitube sometimes works like normal but sometimes when I do a keyword search, it will only play the Audio / Sound, and not have any Video feed. This has only been in the past couple weeks. Could Google / Youtube have changed the way the site works to prevent offline viewing?
Does your bash script still work as normal? I've never really worked with scripts at all so I don't know how to utilize it.
I don't know much about their website changes, but yes, it still works.
A shorter version of the script:
mplayer `youtube-dl -g "$*"`
To use it, save it as yt.sh, make it executable by "chmod u+x yt.sh", then type ./yt.sh "http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxxxxxxxxx".
To call it as an installed program, copy it to /usr/bin without any file extension, only "yt", then call it by "yt" and the URL quoted.
Alternatively, you can type this as a command in the terminal and replace $* with the URL. To view another video, type the up arrow to bring the last command and replace the URL again.
I ommitted &> /dev/null. What it means is "move all output to /dev/null". You wouldn't get any text on the terminal while watching the video.
Update about cclive/clive: They removed support for playing on-the-fly. You can use get-flash-videos instead and call it get_flash_videos -p "URL". It will, however, save the file locally so you have to delete it if you don't want it.
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