My family has smart TVs and I am scared.

48 risposte [Ultimo contenuto]
YoHooComics
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Iscritto: 07/17/2013

I live with my family. Every single television in our house is now a "Smart" TV.

I hate this, I'm scared. I tried to tell them, they wouldn't listen. First it was "you're parinoid" and I proved to them that it collects personal data and they said "I've got nothing to hide".

Can any Trisquelers help me? What do I do? We have two LG Smart TV's and a Panasonic Smart Viera.

JadedCtrl
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Iscritto: 08/11/2014

Same thing over here. There's no way to convince them or any such thing. It's their freedom and privacy they're ridding of.
I tried telling my family about these things, but they all don't care about privacy. At all. They have this "I have nothing to hide, privacy doesn't exist" mentality, and it extends to the NSA and smart-TVs.

The best thing you can do is maybe bring it up every once and a while without being annoying, and have your TV be a "dumb" TV.

YoHooComics
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Iscritto: 07/17/2013

I live here. That's the problem. I have no way out. They are imposing restiction and non-privacy on me. THAT'S the problem.

JadedCtrl
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Iscritto: 08/11/2014

Oh. That's bad.
Perhaps explain to them why privacy is important, and maybe they'll start to care. Maybe.

YoHooComics
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Iscritto: 07/17/2013

Yeah, I have showed them User Liberation. Hopefully all this Free Software everywhere (I use only Free Software on my computers) will convince them that they need to change their ways.

tomlukeywood
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Iscritto: 12/05/2014

i have the same problem
it rely worries me that it has a inbuilt microphone and camera and is connected to the internet...
but even though my family understand and dont like the fact they can be spyed on it seems to be too hard for them to sell a tv they like and spent alot of money on

the main problem is pepole cant see the problem and so its easy to pretend its not there...

freeme
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Iscritto: 10/10/2012

Only old people still watch TV.

wpurcell
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Iscritto: 11/07/2009

Thank you very much.......

a_slacker_here
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Iscritto: 06/30/2013

lol

Dave_Hunt

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Iscritto: 09/19/2011

Who you calling "Old"? lol!

Jodiendo
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Iscritto: 01/09/2013

Insipid TROLL COMMENT!

SuperTramp83

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Iscritto: 10/31/2014

I threw away my dumb tv 3 or 4 years ago. My brain thanks me every day. It whispers to me: "thank you, thank you , you are awesome!" :)
There is nothing you can do really besides explaining once or twice why giving up privacy is immoral and very very dangerous in the long run.
People start to care about it only when they find themselves deep in the shit..
And saying "I don't have nothing to hide" is plain stupid for several reasons.

quantumgravity
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Iscritto: 04/22/2013

Well spoken, supertramp...
Throw away your television!

rakyi
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Iscritto: 05/09/2014

It's a repeat of a story told:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hB-WHw6uMWg

YoHooComics
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Iscritto: 07/17/2013

Yeah. You're right. I don't watch TV, ever, so it is more of their problem. They also use Netflix, which I don't like much either.

Magic Banana

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Iscritto: 07/24/2010

Do you know Popcorn Time? Here it is: https://popcorntime.io

Jodiendo
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Iscritto: 01/09/2013

SuperTramp83 said:

I threw away my dumb tv 3 or 4 years ago. My brain thanks me every day. It whispers to me: "thank you, thank you , you are awesome!" :)

That was a ignorant, you could gave sold them to someone or pawn them for a small profit! or you could had use them as monitor, if they were compatible.
Bad insipid move Mr.

I slap you with my sticking fish over your head. Dummy!

Martago
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Iscritto: 01/11/2015

Maybe this could be help you ...

When your parents say something like this: "I've got nothing to hide" then is it your right to say: "Show me your bank account". Probably they doesn't understand it, but everyone has something to hide and it is important to hide it.

For me I try for one year to find a good gnu/linux distribution (Actually it is Trisquel and I hope it will be so) and my parents doesn't understand it, why I am crashing always my pc. At the end, I have a free system without any viruses and my parents have an cracked windows with many viruses and the anti virus programm has a hard life.

Jabjabs
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Iscritto: 07/05/2014

I would throw away my TV but the wife won't let me. :D Before we moved in together I was free of that rotten box for a good 7 years. Once you start to see it in the house again do you realize just how poisonous and dangerous it is to society, at least on the commercial channels.

Here in Australia we do have two channels that focus on news, foreign content and documentaries that for the most part appear to above the usual slime but these are a rare oasis in the sea of deceit.

So now there is a "Smart TV" in our house but I will never let it get a network connection so at least it's functionality is limited to being a dumb screen.

Newbie
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Iscritto: 01/09/2015

You wrote:
First it was "you're parinoid" and I proved to them that it collects personal data and they said "I've got nothing to hide".

You may tell them to read this article: http://falkvinge.net/2012/07/19/debunking-the-dangerous-nothing-to-hide-nothing-to-fear/

SuperTramp83

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Iscritto: 10/31/2014

good article. I would add a point which seems to me more important yet. I will use an example.

-Take a child and place it in a room in which there are no adults to survey him - that child is free in the true sense of the word: he can and will do everything that pleases him joyfully and spontaneously. The child in a free environment will have therefore the FREEDOM TO CHOOSE how to behave and what to do.

-The same child in the same environment in the presence of a controller (an adult with authority) will lose both the joy and the spontaneity and what is more important (in a negative sense), the child will have no independent freedom, that is to say, the child CANNOT CHOOSE how to behave and what to do.

It is this ability to choose how to behave and what to do that makes us really human. When a human being is surveiled he is no longer human for he ceases to express himself freely and becomes a fearful and constructed shadow of a man, a scared and artificial child that is no more human then a poor pavlov's dog.

t3g
t3g
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Iscritto: 05/15/2011

My Sony Bravia plays WebM and MKV which helps.

quantumgravity
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Iscritto: 04/22/2013

Sorry, but why are you scared?
I can understand that you feel upset, pissed off, oppressed...
Some big companies and states are controlling now the device in your living room, doing *mass surveillance* like they do with millions of other people.
That's unethical and unjust and of course your family should throw the tv out the window, but unless you're a whistleblower or a political activist, I can't see any danger whatsoever and clearly no reason to be scared.

You can ask your parents if it's ok for them to install a webcam in their bedroom for a school project - I mean they have nothing to hide, don't they??

That said: just don't use the device for yourself and that's it.
It's their right to install whatever bullshit in their living room if they want to;
if they want to watch something with you, you can refuse the offer, stating your reasons.

onpon4
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Iscritto: 05/30/2012

Here's a dangerous trick: call the TVs "telescreens", and refuse to do anything in the presence of them. That might trigger a helpful response, depending on what kind of people your parents are and whether they've read Nineteen Eighty-Four. If they're the wrong kind of people, though, they might just turn it into a joke and make fun of you for it, so only use it if you are pretty confident that it will have the desired result.

davidnotcoulthard (non verificato)
davidnotcoulthard

Ah, maybe we should start a newspeak forum, and talk about making RMS and the protagonists in the revolutionary war unpersons.

tomlukeywood
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Iscritto: 12/05/2014

my family use iphones and my familys tv has a microphone
and is connected to the internet
this means that theres nowere in my house that i could not be spyed on with a mic
and i could not talk to any member of my family without being spyed on as they all have iphones

as a result of this i decided not to speak untill they made an effort to get rid of the devices

it lasted a few days untill i broke as my family kept wrongly stating why it was doing it the reason they gave was that "he dosent like apple" which i dont but i was doing it for a diffrent reason
that i think pepole have i right to speak and not be monitored

now nothing has rely changed apart from i now relise that not talking for a large amount of time is rely rely rely hard!

and its even harder when you want to state your views and cant

SuperTramp83

I am a translator!

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Iscritto: 10/31/2014

Under the spreading chestnut tree
I sold you and you sold me
There lie they, and here lie we
Under the spreading chestnut tree

Jodiendo
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Iscritto: 01/09/2013

That chestnut was cut down for not bearing fruits of truth....

jbar
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Iscritto: 01/22/2011

Smart tv is a tv that watches you
Smart phone is a phone that watches you
Smart 'something' is 'something' that watches you

A curious use of the smart word related to a device.

SuperTramp83

I am a translator!

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Iscritto: 10/31/2014

smart phone is a phone that knows more about you then your own mama!

Ishamael
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Iscritto: 08/29/2014

Excuse me sir, but you seem to be lost.

Allow me to point you in the right direction.

>>> http://windowsforum.com/

Off you go now.

Ishamael
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Iscritto: 08/29/2014

BTW can anyone recommend a good 60+ inch "Dumb" tv that's monitor compatible with Trisquel through VGA? Also any information about things to look for to avoid buying one that's "smart" in any way is very much needed, tags, symbols, markings language, anything. Supposedly most of the recent ones made have an FCC tag with a seven digit serial ("smart" meters also have this) which indicates the box comes with unnecessary radio transmitting abilities.

SuperTramp83

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Iscritto: 10/31/2014

yoohoocomics - just in case the force of the habit made your paranoia decrease somehow... this was posted on diaspora, copy and paste here===>

I’m Terrified of My New TV: Why I’m Scared to Turn This Thing On — And You’d Be, Too

I just bought a new TV. The old one had a good run, but after the volume got stuck on 63, I decided it was time to replace it. I am now the owner of a new “smart” TV, which promises to deliver streaming multimedia content, games, apps, social media, and Internet browsing. Oh, and TV too.

The only problem is that I’m now afraid to use it. You would be too — if you read through the 46-page privacy policy.

The amount of data this thing collects is staggering. It logs where, when, how, and for how long you use the TV. It sets tracking cookies and beacons designed to detect “when you have viewed particular content or a particular email message.” It records “the apps you use, the websites you visit, and how you interact with content.” It ignores “do-not-track” requests as a considered matter of policy.

It also has a built-in camera — with facial recognition. The purpose is to provide “gesture control” for the TV and enable you to log in to a personalized account using your face. On the upside, the images are saved on the TV instead of uploaded to a corporate server. On the downside, the Internet connection makes the whole TV vulnerable to hackers who have demonstrated the ability to take complete control of the machine.

More troubling is the microphone. The TV boasts a “voice recognition” feature that allows viewers to control the screen with voice commands. But the service comes with a rather ominous warning: “Please be aware that if your spoken words include personal or other sensitive information, that information will be among the data captured and transmitted to a third party.” Got that? Don’t say personal or sensitive stuff in front of the TV.

You may not be watching, but the telescreen is listening.

I do not doubt that this data is important to providing customized content and convenience, but it is also incredibly personal, constitutionally protected information that should not be for sale to advertisers and should require a warrant for law enforcement to access.

Unfortunately, current law affords little privacy protection to so-called “third party records,” including email, telephone records, and data stored in “the cloud.” Much of the data captured and transmitted by my new TV would likely fall into this category. Although one federal court of appeals has found this rule unconstitutional with respect to email, the principle remains a bedrock of modern electronic surveillance.

According to retired General David Petraeus, former head of the CIA, Internet-enabled “smart” devices can be exploited to reveal a wealth of personal data. “Items of interest will be located, identified, monitored, and remotely controlled through technologies such as radio-frequency identification, sensor networks, tiny embedded servers, and energy harvester,” he reportedly told a venture capital firm in 2012. “We’ll spy on you through your dishwasher” read one headline. Indeed, as the “Internet of Things” matures, household appliances and physical objects will become more networked. Your ceiling lights, thermostat, and washing machine — even your socks — may be wired to interact online. The FBI will not have to bug your living room; you will do it yourself.

Of course, there is always the “dumb” option. Users may have the ability to disable data collection, but it comes at a cost. The device will not function properly or allow the use of its high-tech features. This leaves consumers with an unacceptable choice between keeping up with technology and retaining their personal privacy.

We should not have to channel surf worried that the TV is recording our behavior for the benefit of advertisers and police. Companies need to become more mindful of consumer privacy when deciding whether to collect personal data. And law enforcement should most certainly be required to get a warrant before accessing it.

In the meantime, I’ll be in the market for a new tinfoil hat and cone of silence.

Trisquelian
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Iscritto: 01/23/2015

Not one mention of the Brand, model or reference documentation? A "Smart" TV can be a wonderful tool in the realm of Free software. I see lot of generalization for the concept and not for the current status quo.

onpon4
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Iscritto: 05/30/2012

I disagree. A "smart TV" is nothing more than building a computer into the TV. You can easily achieve the same effect by plugging in a computer to a normal TV. I do this all the time with my laptop, and you could also use any desktop PC. Think Penguin's "Penguin Wee" computers would be perfect for this.

Trisquelian
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Iscritto: 01/23/2015

You also will have to understand that you do not represent the whole user-base for the "Smart TV" technology and there are can be many applications in the enterprise and hospitality world among others. The products that are are mostly talked about are catered towards households and Facebook users (the latter is used frequently on adverts in my country as an incentive).

JadedCtrl
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Iscritto: 08/11/2014

I literately haven't seen a single productive "enterprise" use of a Smart TV.

lembas
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Iscritto: 05/13/2010
axgb
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Iscritto: 09/22/2013

1) Put a piece of black tape over the camera
2) Open up the remote/TV, and rip out the microphone / put a drop of superglue in the microphone.
3) Make sure that you do not put any of your personal details into the TV.

Problem gone like magic.

tomlukeywood
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Iscritto: 12/05/2014

the problem is not completely gone it could still monitor
what your watching

getting into the computer isn’t too easy also

also i have heard its possible to turn speakers into microphones
http://www.zyra.org.uk/sp-mic.htm

SuperTramp83

I am a translator!

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Iscritto: 10/31/2014

I think everybody aware of the matter should talk and explain to those that have no idea of how much personal info,and what kind of info, those monstrosities collect!
Those who know, those who are aware, but don't care, I feel sorry for them - but if they don't care about their privacy, well, it is their freedom to give away their freedom! As it is for an idiot to be an idiot..
That being said - this is a typical prove of the degree of indifference and carelessness of the "21st century schizoid man". And is also a prove that men can get used to everything. This info collection of personal data did not happen overnight - it was progressive and it stretched over at least two decades. Imagine if something like PRISM or those heinous smart things did happen sometime in the 1960s or 70s - I guarantee you there would have been a riot in every mayor city in the world. But not today - people just got used to being spied on - they got so used to it that they consider it a normal state and keep saying: "I don't care. I have nothing to hide!"
Meanwhile every city in the industrialized world has videocameras pointed on every street! In the name of security! Computers, cellphones, tvs, all of them spy for the big brother. I remember when I first read 1984 when I was 15 years old - I was shocked for I could see that happening then and there in the real world. I remember clearly how obsessed I became with that book and the disappointment I felt knowing that my friends who read the book, all but very few of them, didn't take it very seriously. Ten years ago I thought the world was much more similar to Brave New World. Now I think it is a mixture of the two books and I'm sure if this mental illness progresses the next decade or the decade after will be very similar (if not worse) to 1984.
And when the modern slave will find himself living in the modern panopticon the sentence "I don't have nothing to hide" will sadly reflect the reality, that is a reality in which men have nothing to hide because hiding anything from the evil eye will simply be impossible! There will be no Tor and there will be no Gollum magical ring of invisibility..

lloydsmart

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Iscritto: 12/22/2012
muhammed
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Iscritto: 04/13/2013

(in reply also to lembas)

"Many LG Smart TVs come with a remote control or other input devices that can be operated using voice commands. We may use your Voice Information to power the voice activation used by the Smart TV or input device (e.g., remote control). If you do not agree to our use of your Voice Information then you will not be able to use the voice command and recognition features. Apart from this Privacy Policy, you will be provided a specific opportunity to agree or disagree with the collection and use of Voice Information. Please be aware that if your spoken word includes personal or other sensitive information, such information will be among the Voice Information captured through your use of voice recognition features."

12 May 2014
http://doctorbeet.blogspot.ca/2014/05/lg-disables-smart-tv-features-in-eu-to.html

Also the USB memory file-name vacuuming (November 18 2013):
http://doctorbeet.blogspot.ca/2013/11/lg-smart-tvs-logging-usb-filenames-and.html

G4JC
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Iscritto: 03/11/2012

RE: Can any Trisquelers help me? What do I do? We have two LG Smart TV's and a Panasonic Smart Viera.

You can do a number of things.

- At the router level you can find out which hosts it is connecting to (via e.g. WireShark) and blackhole those domains.
Tom's Hardware provides an example for LG TV's:
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/lg-smart-tv-hdtv-doctorbeet-privacy,25156.html
TODO: Someone needs to make a list of these domains and IP addresses for all SmartTV brands for blacklisting purposes

- You can put tape over the camera which is on several Smart TV's. Or support FSF/EFF and buy some nice stickers to cover it up.

- You can go into settings and disable the "Smart" features. (Note: As the code is not open it is quite possible disabling doesn't always do what it claims to do. As the guy found with LG, disabling it didn't prevent it from connecting to the internet)

Samsung settings menu:
http://www.cnet.com/uk/how-to/samsung-smart-tv-spying/
Quote: Head to the Settings menu and select Smart Features. Then scroll down to Voice Recognition and switch it off. While you will no longer be able to use the "Hi TV" command to activate the voice features, you can still access them by pressing the microphone button on your remote.

- You could physically remove the camera and microphone

- You can try to write free firmware for SmartTV's but, there is a fight over DMCA and this as we speak...
http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2015/02/10/samsung_s_smarttv_disabling_its_eavesdropping_could_violate_dmca.html

- Inside the firmware of a Samsung SmartTV:
http://kingofdkingz99.blogspot.com/2013/05/firmware-hacking-samsung-smart-tv-turn.html

SuperTramp83

I am a translator!

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Iscritto: 10/31/2014

http://www.cnet.com/news/samsung-changes-smarttv-privacy-policy-in-wake-of-spying-fears/

Don't worry we are not spying on you - we are just selling your data to Nuance Communication! Nuance Communication almost certainly sells it to the government and everybody interested enough to pay for it
Disgusting and pathetic

tomlukeywood
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Iscritto: 12/05/2014

i dont know if they would sell it as in some countries include the usa by law the data must be given to the "security agencys" like the NSA