Need to Uninstall Trisquel
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I thought I had more memory than I do, must've misread. My machine is an old HP. I put the full Trisquel on it and got a GNOME shell to help with accessibility issues, but awhile after, the machine did something strange- started scrambling the stuff on the screen, usually when I was multitasking. Someone helping told me how to check my memory and said I can't use this version, so I got Trisquel Mini, now I have to delete Trisquel. I want to do this safely, so I need advice on exactly WHAT to delete. So it's back to using the old low tech physical magnifier again for when I can't raise the font on a webpage without having other text get in the way. Before I knew about the GNOME shell, I had a magnifier program but I didn't like it.
When I got Trisquel Mini, I got it using Terminal, with guidance from someone who knows a lot more than me. Till things settle down with IRC I won't risk going back there. The Trisquel room there was wonderful. One or two of the people there is on this forum.
There's a few issues with Trisquel Mini that I can't resolve but first I need to fix the mess on my machine. If possible I want to get a backup of the program, if I could find it.
Thank you for the time and help you give here.
hi, thank you for replying. I left microsoft years ago, though I also have a Mac that someday I'd love to put the full Trisquel version on. For now it's on a VM there.
I saw the packages in Synaptic, read a few of the properties to be sure what was involved. Some have a description that implies it's the actual full program. My files are backed up, so I'm ready to do it. I don't understand much techno but I manage ok with help. I forgot how much memory I have but it's about 2 GB I think. What is fluxbox? Before doing anything I have to delete what I have, except Trisquel Mini, because I have no backup program or startup disk. Whatever I nstalled also has something called openbox, and something else, starts with an L. My poor machine is a netbook I hardly used, it had microsoft on it, I got help converting it almost a year ago, using my Mac to correspond with someone who guided me on a messenger program, also helped me set up the VM there to test Trisquel to see how I'd like it.
There's no need to PM, though I really appreciate the offer, maybe this will help someone else, too.
Thanks again.
EDIT
PS Openmailbox, name sounds familiar. If I remember right, I was there awhile ago and looked at the openmailbox webpage, and saw google hiding there- probly their analytics program;, thanks to NoScript. According to goo's terms, using their services makes us legally bound by their terms, their terms state that usage means they can get into our files and do whatever they want with them. I block them fast, and hope they didn't sneak in.
you said, "Boot to the netinstall image. Install the base system. Do NOT install the Trisquel desktop, Triskel desktop, or Trisquel-mini desktop."
I'm embarrassed to admit I don't know what a netinstall image is.
EDIT: I'm researching ii now, found a link for it too. :)
Thank you for helping. I got the info but can't copy/paste to or from the terminal, I don't know why.
Are you using keyboard shortcuts? For some reason, when selecting, copying, and pasting in terminal windows, you have to hold SHIFT as well as Ctrl-a, Ctrl-c, or Ctrl-v. So to copy text from the terminal, you use Ctrl-SHIFT-C. To paste into the terminal you use Ctrl-SHIFT-V.
Hi. keyboard shortcuts didn't work, what worked is highlighting the text in Terminal, then when I pasted to my file, I just press the wheel in the middle. :) The command line doc is wonderful.
I do not quite get the situation. Are two Trisquel systems installed on your computer? If so, you did not need to install Trisquel Mini alongside Trisquel. You could just have installed the "trisquel-mini" package (and "trisquel-mini-recommended" for lighter applications) and choose it at the graphical connection screen (where you click on your user name). Even going through a fresh install, why haven't you installed Trisquel Mini on top of Trisquel (after a backup of your data, of course)?
2 GB of RAM is enough for Trisquel with GNOME Shell. My wife has just that on her laptop. And even if it was not enough, the system would only be unbearably slow. It would not have display issues. When you write that you checked the RAM, was it with memtest86+? Were there errors (the screen turning red)? If so, it is an hardware problem that no software would solve: you need to change your RAM.
Anyway, please show us the output of the following command, to execute in a terminal (your password will be asked):
$ sudo parted -l
I got the info after having trouble copying/pasting to/from Terminal. See post down a ways. The command Heather gave me worked.
It's good to know you can transform a standard Trisquel install into Trisquel-Mini by installing a couple of packages, but if the OP had done that, she couldn't be sure that any issues that came up were not the result of something that had happened with the older install. One benefit of doing a fresh install for testing purposes is that you know any issues that occur are endemic to that hardware/ software combination alone.
GNOME Shell definitely needs at least 2GB RAM. My 1GB netbook has not run reliably with GNOME Shell since I "upgraded" it to Trisquel 7, and was having issues with 6 too. Trisquel-Mini works better, although I prefer Enlightenment to LXDM, which is a bit of a toy by comparison. Enlightenment does have some issues, as desktop environments often do when added later to a system that wasn't assembled with them in mind. I'd love to see a 100% libre distro with Enlightenment as the default desktop, aimed at supporting older machines (XP and Vista laptops would be a good target).
hi, thanks for your input too. :) Hopefully this thread can help others.
I have the info they asked for, just figuring out exactly what to post from the list on Terminal, they probly don't need the entire list but I have it if they do, it's not too long.
somehow I got $ sudo parted -l to work today:
Model: ATA TOSHIBA MK1665GS (scsi)
Disk /dev/sda: 160GB
Sector size (logical/physical): 512B/512B
Partition Table: msdos
Number Start End Size Type File system Flags
1 1049kB 20.0GB 20.0GB primary ext4 boot
2 20.0GB 160GB 140GB extended
5 20.0GB 23.2GB 3191MB logical linux-swap(v1)
6 23.2GB 160GB 137GB logical xfs
hello Heather and Magic Banana, I got the info, I don't know if you need the entire results from the Terminal, but I have it if needed.
1.60GHz
cpu MHz : 1333.000
cache size : 512 KB
I can edit this if more info is needed.
Welcome to Trisquel Misty!
I have a similar situation to you with an old mini-laptop (full description here: https://trisquel.info/en/users/strypey). I was running full Trisquel 7, and with help from some of the folks here, I identified that the issues I was having were to do with insufficient RAM. As mentioned above, I started using Enlightenment instead of GNOME Shell, which works a lot better but still had some issues. So, I installed Trisquel-Mini in a separate partition to see if it works any better (not really).
What I suggest you do is back up any files you want to keep (your documents, photos etc) onto USB drives (*), and start again from scratch.
1) Delete all existing partitions, and create new partitions, using GParted, from a live disk (eg a Trisquel install disk or a GParted-Live disk: http://gparted.org/livecd.php)
Everyone has their preferred partition scheme, but I suggest something like:
* 20GB ext4 main OS partition: this is for the OS you are using on a daily basis. 20GB is large, but that gives you plenty of space for future updates, installing more applications and games etc. 10 years ago 5B was more than big enough, so making it 20GB should be future proof for at least that long, and you'll be lucky if an ex-Windows computer is still usable in 10 years, even running GNU+Linux and lightweight desktops.
* 10GB ext4 test OS partition: this is for when you want to test other GNU+Linux distros or versions
* ext4 /home partition: this takes up whatever space is left on the hard drive, and is for your documents, photos, music, videos etc.
When you do a fresh install to either your main OS or test OS partition, you can mount this partition as /home. Then all your files will be available under 'Home' when you boot the new OS, and any files you create will be stored there and accessible from any other OS you set up this way. Make sure you *DON'T* tick the 'format' tick box when you do this!
As an example, my mini-laptop currently has 3 partitions:
1) Full Trisquel 7 (GNOME Shell) plus Enlightenment (or OpenBox for games) that has been my primary OS
2) Trisquel-Mini 7 (LXDE) plus Enlightenment that I've been testing
3) Separate user files partition, mounted as /home
Once you have a partition scheme like this set up, it becomes much easier to test drive other distros or versions without interfering with your day-to-day OS or repartitioning. It also makes it easier to reinstall your main OS without having to copy all your user files off the computer and back on again. It's always a good idea to make sure you have recent backups, especially when you are installing a new OS, but unless something goes wrong, you won't need to use them. Again, this is only true if you make sure you *DON'T* tick the 'format' tick box when you do this! The potential to make mistakes like this is why it's worth making sure you have fresh backups before you get started on any new install.
* Storage tip: you can get 256GB USB drives from about $50 now. Four of those gives you about 1TB of storage for about $200. You can get a a 1TB USB magnetic drive for much less than that, but USB flash drives are much less likely to crap out. If you have your data spread across a collection of smaller flash drives, you're spreading your risk, and it's a much less appealing target for thieves than a 1TB magnetic USB drive.
hi Strypey, wow that is a lot of technical info. I've never looked at partitions on here so I'll have to do that but I'm not sure how, or how to set them up. My info is on 2 backup drives each have 500 GB. One thing I really want to do is back up my browser, with all its settings, it took me a while to tweak it so I don't want to lose it. I don't mind doing a fresh install if it'll solve my problems. I have my Mac as a backup so I could go there if I goof here and can't get online. I would need to put the programs I need to install on here on a flash drive.
I strongly recommend learning about partitions, as this will make installs and reinstalls much less confusing for you. I started learning about them when I was trained as a Windows technician but most of what I know now is self-learned.
BTW In my other comment, I forgot to mention that you will also need "swap partitions", which are slices of the hard drive that are reserved in case you run out of memory. I usually make swap partitions the same size as the amount of RAM on that computer. You need a separate swap partition for each OS partition, although you can usually shrink your ext4 partitions during install to make space for a Swap partition.
Sorry if this is all a bit confusing, but stick with it! Most of us here have learned what we know by a combination of web searches, making illuminating mistakes, and getting advice from people like the friendly and helpful folks who frequent this forum.
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> I usually make swap partitions the same size as the amount of RAM on that computer.
From what I gathered around, the size of the swap partition is very relative. On modern computers (say 4 or better yet 8 gb of RAM) swap is hardly needed at all and you could even omit it without ever encountering any issue whatsoever (unless you edit heavy pics/vids or whatever may drain a modern monster).
OP has 1 gb of RAM. In this case, the swap partition is **vital** as the probability of filling the RAM up is very high. Hence my recommendation is to make it double in this case - go for 2 gb of swap, just to be safe.
I have an old laptop, 2 gb ram, 2 gb swap. I am pretty certain I never even touched the /swap..
But then again I hate multitasking and I extremely enjoy lightweight applications. My average RAM usage is 400/500 mb :)
If you want to hibernate a system, you need swap because hibernating is dumping the main memory onto the swap (after zipping it). That is why those who hibernate their systems are often recommended to choose at least as much swap as RAM.
A system that never hibernates had better have a (small) swap partition than no swap at all. With no swap, the kernel kills a process as soon as the system runs out of RAM. It may happen even if the system has a huge amount of RAM, e.g., because of a memory leak triggered in some special conditions. The kernel's choice of the process to kill is rather arbitrary and it may not kill the faulty process.
With 1 GB of swap (for instance), the user of a desktop system will have time to notice that her system has become slow, to save her work, and to choose what application(s) to close to free some RAM. For server systems, the intervention (after an alert sent by a monitoring system) may take longer and such systems had better have more swap.
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> e.g., because of a memory leak triggered in some special conditions.
^ this is very true, it happened to me with my previous laptop, and several times, while using Iceweasel. Another few times with tumblerd, while viewing a large gif, it just went crazy and ram filled in a matter of seconds.
True also the hibernation point. I never hibernate my laptop but this is something to consider too.
A few points in response to the above:
* Some distros will refuse to install unless a /swap partition is defined, and they create one automatically if you choose 'guided partitioning'.
* If OP has only 1GB RAM, they need Trisquel-Mini, or at least a much more lightweight desktop than GNOME. I recently tried Uruk on my Aspire One (1GB "netbook") which uses Mate, but as soon as I opened a browser and started watching a video on YouTube, it fell over :( Sure, I could use VLC to watch YT videos instead, or use NoScript or whatever, but these are ugly hacks compared to using the site like average folks do.
* Speaking of memory leaks, Firefox-based software is infamous for them. The lagging, freezing, and crashing problems I've had running GNU/Linux of various flavours on older machines have *always* involved a browser. Miro (formerly Democracy Player) never works no matter how powerful a PC I've tried it on, and I suspect the problem is memory leaks inherited from the Mozilla code the Miro developers fork.
Hello SuperTrmp83, thank you for your help, too. I'm very thankful to all of you for taking time to explain and guide me. :)
Somedy I would like to get another machine, a Libreboot system. I've seen a couple of sites that have them, and I want a libre router or something as close to it as poible, I saw something like tht, too.. Till then I'll use this machine so I can get help converting my Mac, but it'd be so great to have something more respecting of our rights.
A swap partition is not "needed". One can have a swap file instead. And one swap partition can be shared between several GNU/Linux distributions: specify it in the /etc/fstab file of each distribution.
Misty has 1 GB of RAM and 3 GB of swap. It is far enough swap: the swap being on a disk, it is about 100 times slower than RAM (10 times slower if we are talking an SSD disk): Misty will be fed up with an unbearably slow system before using even 1 GB of swap and she will start closing applications.
Wow this is all very interesting. what can I do, what can I run that will not use too much resources?
Well, run "lighter" applications. The first tab of the "GNOME System Monitor" (that I presented to you) allows to see how much CPU/memory each process currently uses. You can click on the header that says "Memory" to rank the processes by decreasing order of the space they occupy in the RAM. In this way, you will discover what applications eat up most of your memory. As long as the total amount does not reach 1 GB, your system is fast.
OK. I was there a day or 2 ago. I wish you could see this. will examine it carefully. Thank you. :)
so they were right that I can't run Trisuel? It's amazing how I did it at all.
You can run Trisquel... just not Abrowser, Evolution and LibreOffice at the same time.
ok, thanks. usually I would run IceCat and one other program. what about the scrambled screen? What about GNOME shell?
I use GNOME Shell. My graphical session has been opened for the past 44 hours (doing a number of things). According to my "System Monitor", GNOME Shell currently uses 186 MB of RAM. A lot for a computer like yours that only has 1 GB.
Like I wrote earlier, a scrambled screen never is "normal". Even when running out of resource. Either a software bug caused it or some hardware (probably the RAM) is failing and should be replaced. How often does it happen?
I'm gonna look up some stuff on here to se if I can find the info before asking more questions. Thanks again for all your help. :)
how do I replace the RAM? The scrambling happened a lot. If this involves opening up my machine, I'd have to send it to a repair place. I never intended it to be online or be my main computer, but for now I want it to be stable enough till I can convert my Mac, or get something that's more respecting of our rights.
Replacing RAM is not hard. But let us first see if it really is defective! There is a package for that: "memtest86+". Install it, e.g., with the "Synaptic Package Manager" or with the following command (to be executed in a terminal):
$ sudo apt-get install memtest86+
Memtest86+ does not run inside GNU/Linux. It is to be executed from the bootloader. Do you have, almost right after switching on your computer, a two-entry menu with "Trisquel" and "Advanced options"? If so, memtest86+ must be inside "Advanced options". The problem is, GRUB will ask for a user name and a password. The user name is "grub" and the password is a number that was randomly generated when you installed Trisquel. You can read it at the end of what this commands (to be executed in a terminal) outputs:
$ sudo cat /etc/grub.d/01_PASSWORD
If you manage to execute memtest86+ (otherwise please explain in details what you did and what is the problem you face), let it run for hours (e.g., for one night). If the screen turns red: the RAM is defective. Otherwise, it is OK.
OK. I'll check it out and see what happens and report the results as soon as possible. Thank you for explaining all this.
A message from Terminal has a warning saying The following packages cannot be authenticated! memtest86+
Hmmm... Try to change the mirror of Trisquel's repository you grab your software from. In Trisquel's "System Settings", there is a tool named "Software & Updates". Te same window can be opened from the "Settings" menu of the "Synaptic Package Manager": click on "Repositories".
"Download from" defines the mirror. You can even "Select Best Server" (the one answering more rapidly, probably the closest to you) with the related button. You are then invited to reload the information on the packages. Do it and try again to install "memtest86+".
It worked. Thanks. :) I'll set it up and report back as soon as possible.
Hi, I'm on my other machine, the memtest is still going on my old one, but at the bottom of the screen a message says it's complete, there's no errors, yet at the top, it's still testing. Is it starting over? I don't know when the message of being complete came up, sometime this morning. It's been running all night. When we're sure it's done, where can I get the report to show you, if you want to see it?
Good news: your RAM is OK. If it was not, the screen would have turned red. Memtest86+ starts over after doing all its tests: you can terminate it now.
Let us now see if the disk is OK. Trisquel has, by default, a tool named "Disks" in the "System Settings". In it, you can select a disk (left-hand side of the interface), click the button with the gear icon (top-right corner) and choose "SMART Data & Self-Tests...". You can then "Start Self-test" (button in the bottom-left corner) and choose an "Extended" test. At the end, the "Overall assessment" will tell you whether the "Disk is OK". If it is not, you had better backup your data asap and very regularly do so (anyway, all users should regularly backup their data).
However, I doubt that errors in reading data on the disk would result in a scrambled screen. If the problem comes from the software, there may be something interesting to read in the logs. Those logs are files in /var/log. They can be read with any text editor (or, from a terminal, with 'less') or, more comfortably, with the "GNOME System Log" tool (by default in Trisquel but not in Trisquel Mini). Let us first see what errors Xorg (the graphical server) reports, i.e., the output of this command:
$ grep '(EE)' /var/log/Xorg.0.log
If the screen gets scrambled, it would be interesting to read the end of the logs after it happens. Without exiting the session (or rebooting the computer) first. To get a (real) terminal, type Ctrl+Alt+F1. It should always work. Even if the display of the graphical session has become unreadable. Enter your user name and your password and copy the Xorg log in this way (here to a file named "EE.log") that you can then attach to a post on this forum:
$ cp /var/log/Xorg.0.log EE.log
To get back to the graphical session, type Alt+F7. By the way, would that unscramble the screen? If so, we have a fix! If not, there is no need to reboot. Here is how to restart the whole graphical stack from the terminal (again, you can get one with Ctrl+Alt+F1):
$ sudo restart lightdm
I assume here that you use LightDM, which is both Trisquel's and Trisquel Mini's default display manager. Of course the work you were achieving in the graphical session should be first saved... if possible!
OK and thanks. I started the self test, this will take awhile it looks like.
Disk Self Test is complete, Disk is OK. Now onto the next thing. I'm in Trisquel there so I can do the next suggestion. Report coming soon. Thanks. :)
I got an error message, (WW) warning, (EE) error, (NI) not implemented. (???) unknown.
The (EE) is in red.
If that is the only line output, then there is no error. This line just explains, at the beginning of the log what "(WW)" means, what "(EE)" means, etc.
It didn't explain anything. I went to the documents, found some logs, have to find which one might show any info about the screen prob.
EDIT:
There's lots of logs, I looked at a few, can't understand them, they don't say much. Oh well.
I didn't find anything called LightDM, or a GNOME System Log" tool. Oh I wish I knew what you techies know. It's amazing.
"GNOME System Log" is just a log viewer, by default in Trisquel (not Mini). Assuming it really is installed on your system, you can launch it from the terminal or from the Alt+F2 prompt:
$ gnome-system-log
LightDM is Trisquel's default display manager. It is automatically launched when the system starts. I was just telling you that you need not reboot when the screen gets scrambled. You can just restart the graphical session with the following command, which you can execute from a text session (such as the one you get with Ctrl+Alt+F1):
$ sudo restart lightdm
But, before that, you could copy some logs (if there is anything interesting there, it is probably written when the screen gets scrambled). And you could take a look at whether a process is guilty of using much CPU and/or memory:
$ top
I never knew about the Alt-F2 thing! How useful! Thanks for sharing that tip.
I have thought for a while that it would be great if something like that could be built into the taskbar in GNU/Linux desktops in some way, so new GNU/Linux users can see what's going on under the hood, and run commands, from within the default interface. Switching to a terminal or opening a virtual terminal window becomes second nature eventually, but for people who've never used a computer without pointing and clicking, it can be quite intimidating at first.
I'm never using the "real terminal" again because I couldn't get out of it. I tried and had to force my machine to restart. Nope, not doing that again. I looked up commands, strange, I could get out of the other Terminals. So I hope I can continue using the one I found that I like, though it's not the "real Terminal." I spent awhile searching the Command Line doc, it said ossibly F7 or F8 would return me to the desktop from the Terminal but it did not. I tested this in the one I'm familiar with that doesn't take up the whole screen, in case I couldn't get out again. Once I was in the "real Terminal", I was stuck. I typed in my name and pw, then tried to quit to be sure I remembered the command. So I have to work with what I know how to get out of. The command that works in my preferred Terminal is exit. It didn't work in the other one.
In the Command Line manual, I searched for it, I typed in everything I could think of. I tried the help in the Terminal, there was so much stuff there, I don't know why I couldn't find it. Somehow I remembered 'exit' from a very distant memory and tried it in desperation. When I said my tech skills stink, I meant it.
So anyway.........
I typed in $ top, got so much stuff I have no idea how to read it. One part looked like it said 2 users. what the heck, I'm the only user, unless it's referring to a previous name I had and previous users, but now I'm the only one. All of them were me, now there's only one of me.
Last night I looked at a log called Bootstrap, it had so much in there, I could never read it all, but it did say some intersting things, I couldn't find any dates within the document to see when things happened. I feel so lost, there's so many logs and so much data.
I've been in Trisquel instead of Mini for the past few days because I like it better, though I don't have the GNOME shell anymore, but when I startup and look where the options are, I thought I saw GNOME but it sends me to a blank screen. Synatic say there's nothing broken but I'm sure I messed up my machine.
Riht now I'm so frustrated with this, I hardly did any tech stuff all day because of it, though I read the thread for anything new but didn't log in. When I did do anything, I found that System Log with the alt+F2, but I wasn't sure how to use it, tried a few things and gave up for today. If I can't find what happened with the screen, I'll have to give that up and just work on getting the best programs for this thing till I can convert the Mac.
Alt+F7 to go back to the graphical session. Like I wrote in https://trisquel.info/forum/need-uninstall-trisquel#comment-104366
Right after firing 'top', you get a list of processes (let us say "programs" to simplify) in decreasing order of %CPU, i.e., of how much processor power each of them is currently draining. The names of the programs are in the rightmost column. If a program is malfunctioning (and causing your display issues), it will probably be at the top of the list, taking much resource. Not only computing resources (%CPU) but also memory (%MEM). The 'q' key quits 'top'.
Again, "GNOME System Log" is just a log viewer. It only allows to read the logs in /var/logs (that you are already looking at), to search in them, etc.
You can attach the logs to your posts here: we may find interesting things for you. I was suggesting to copy the logs right after the screen gets scrambled so that we know interesting things (if any) would be written at the end of the logs.
When the screen scrambled, it was when I had GNOME Shell, which has been removed as the likely suspect, a month ago, but I'm sure an old log would say something about the incident.
I hope it'd be ok to use the terminal I like from Accessories.
You have been very kind and patient with me, it means a lot to me. Thank you. :D
I will look at some info and see what I can find, some log should have what we need. If I can't find it, I'd like to move onto finding asomething that uses less resources. I don't like Mini very much so I should delete it and try something else from the suggestions here. In Synaptic, I saw Fluxbox, I'd like to try that next.
The problem with "Terminal" in "Accessories" is that you would not be able to use it if the screen gets scrambled! On the contrary, text sessions would still be functional.
Anyway, I thought you were regularly having display issues but it looks like you found the culprit one month ago!
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meh..it's all squeezed :(
yea the threads get squeezed, only fix I know is to lower the zoom
Anyway how do I get your prefs file into the browser, I thought I knew how..
I am a translator!
>how do I get your prefs file into the browser
I suggest you read on each one, as my browsing experience is no js, so if you need to use that, or sign into websites that require third party cookies you won't be able, with those preferences in about:config
In your /home/misty/.mozilla/xh539vde(whatever)/
there will be a prefs.js. Open it with a text editor and add the lines you wish.
gna!
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