Trisquel Linux Libre and Debian Linux
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I've used Trisquel on and off. I liked Trisquel 4 very much. Not so sure about Trisquel 7 though. The LXDE version at least doesn't seem as polished as it used to be but I see that I can use Trisquel 6 for a long time yet and I'll give it a go.
I've been using Debian Wheezy and enjoyed this distro very much. I installed it on several computers for friends.
Now I installed Debian Jessie but I suspect Systemd is still not very mature. I hate that both computers running Jessie take ages to shutdown while Wheezy shut down in a breeze. After a Systemd update, at least the desktop computer shuts down completely without me having to press the button on the case — that reminded me of a Pentium II running a release of Puppy some years ago…
Well, image your Windows friends looking at your GNU/Linux computer never really shutting down, and even now taking almost a Windows time to shut down.
As far as freedom is concerned, I was wondering what the difference is between Linux Libre and the Linux kernel delivered by Debian by default.
You know that Debian is shipped without any nonfree stuff and the original sources.list is free from the nonfree-contrib repos.
When I run vrms, I can't find any non free stuff. But is vrms reliable?
Is it possible or reasonable to instal Linux Libre on Debian from jxself's repository?
Now I have a question which is no troll at all and which I don't find the answer to on my own. So I hope you can enlighten me. Here goes:
I know that Trisquel started as a university project and that it's run by one brave guy (hello Rodriguez) and I understand the need for a totally free distro, yet aren't there some drawbacks or difficulties to make a distro from Ubuntu?
In other words, would Trisquel and Debian devs and users benefit from working together to make a totally free Debian? Or a fork if the Debian team can't, for some reason or other, shift the nonfree-contrib packages far away from its servers and mirrors?
Cheers
"When I run vrms, I can't find any non free stuff. But is vrms reliable?"
it will detect if a debian package installed on your system is free or not but it wont detect everything
say if you had a non-free program that was stored in your home directory
"As far as freedom is concerned, I was wondering what the difference is between Linux Libre and the Linux kernel delivered by Debian by default."
not entirely sure but i know by default
its libre
When I run vrms, I can't find any non free stuff. But is vrms reliable?
'vrms' is not properly named. It does not reflect rms' views on software freedoms but Debian's. For instance, it considers that the GNU FDL is non-free! 'vrms' only checks whether the installed packages come from the official non-free repository. It does not check what you install by hand, your browser's extensions, etc. See https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/gnewsense-users/2007-02/msg00027.html for more information.
Is it possible or reasonable to instal Linux Libre on Debian from jxself's repository?
I guess it is possible. But, unless you want another (probably more recent) version of the kernel, there is no need to do so: Debian's kernel now is entirely free software.
I know that Trisquel started as a university project and that it's run by one brave guy (hello Rodriguez) and I understand the need for a totally free distro, yet aren't there some drawbacks or difficulties to make a distro from Ubuntu?
I do not think so. Trisquel being based on Ubuntu does not mean Ubuntu's default system has any influence on Trisquel. Trisquel's default system is built from an arbitrary list of packages and Ubuntu's default system is (if anything) only an inspiration in the choice of these packages. In other words, Trisquel being based on Ubuntu only means most of the packages in Trisquel's repository come from Ubuntu. Because Ubuntu's repositories host proprietary software, not all package are copied. But the selection is no hard work: in theory, everything in "main" and "universe" should be free and the rest is non-free. In practice, it is a bit trickier: some packages raise freedom-related issues. For instance, they may recommend proprietary software.
And here comes the harder work: patching some software/packages so that they comply with FSF's free software guideline and can be copied in Trisquel's repository. For instance to avoid recommending proprietary software. Rúben even started (and it is going well) a 100%-free extension page to substitute that of Mozilla. But all that hard work would remain relevant if Trisquel would be based on Debian. Ubuntu does not "add" freedom issues in Debian's packages. Well, it actually does for the kernel packages but Trisquel's kernel is cooked from Linux-libre's code (a GNU subproject).
Notice that Trisquel used to be based on Debian.
In other words, would Trisquel and Debian devs and users benefit from working together to make a totally free Debian?
Collaboration for free software is always good. I guess it already happens.
Or a fork if the Debian team can't, for some reason or other, shift the nonfree-contrib packages far away from its servers and mirrors?
gNewSense is a Debian-based distribution that is 100% free software: http://gnewsense.org
However gNewSense is not as actively developed as Trisquel. Its last release is based on Debian oldstable.
Debian could ditch "contrib" and "non-free". It is a political choice to make. However, I doubt it will be made anytime soon.
Many thanks, Magic Banana, for your detailed reply :-) Things are clearer to me now.
I thought Ubuntu had a way to always tweak Debian packages that didn't make things easy for outer developers.
I knew Debian Linux was free yet I thought there was still some difference with Linux Libre.
I know of gNewSense but I'd choose Trisquel any time over gNewSense. This distro may not be a Nuisance (as the pun goes, according to Stallman) but it definitely is annoying, being so so ooold and so very boring. Yet, it may be a good choice for old computers.
Hey, my apologies to Ruben for calling him by his second name, my silly mistake.
cheers
"Ubuntu does not "add" freedom issues in Debian's packages. Well, it actually does for the kernel packages but Trisquel's kernel is cooked from Linux-libre's code (a GNU subproject)."
Actually, Trisquel takes Ubuntu's kernel packages and runs the Linux-libre deblob scripts on them. So Trisquel's kernel based on both the Ubuntu kernel and the Linux-libre project.
You mean former oldstable.
Now oldoldstable.
I am a translator!
Yes. Debian is by default 100% libre (it has been since Debian 6).
The kernel is deblobbed.
Yes. You can install the jxself's kernel in Debian. In fact I am using 3.10.80 in Debian 8 stable Xfce and everything works flawlessly. I get all the updates.
I have an ati crap and recent kernels have issues with screen resolution with ati graphics. So I installed the older kernel from the jxself's repo.
Cheers!
Agreed, if you want to run Debian no real reason for the linux libre kernel, unless you want a newer feature of that kernel. Just do not use the non-free and contrib repos.
Cannot recommend Devuan yet, as it is still loosely organized.
Indeed. In 2011's Debian Squeeze, they removed all blobs from the Debian
distribution of the kernel. It is (as far as I can gather) effectively
Linux-libre. If you want to run a free Debian system, only enable the
main repository (this is the default), and you'll be safe.
**I only joined recently- no context, so had to reply to you**
PS. What is the point of Devuan? It's ostensibly Debian with sysvinit as
opposed to systemd, but I don't really see the point. Debian comes
packaged with all three init systems (as of 8.1); you can choose which
to activate (admittedly, after install).
Oh, just some silly people who think that systemd being the default has somehow caused Debian to be infected, or something. Don't worry about it.
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