Libreboot or Canoeboot?
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I recently notice that mentions of Libreboot were change to Canoeboot by user knife at: https://trisquel.info/en/wiki/samsung-chromebook-v1-kevin-support-group
Please be patience with me, I really believe I understand Leah's position in the matter, or at least I think I do, but I do preferred Libreboot position over Canoeboot.
I followed the instructions listed at the Libreboot site https://libreboot.org/docs/install/chromebooks.html so I was sure I was installing Libreboot and not Canoeboot. But now that knife as made some changes I'm not sure anymore.
I don't really mind that Libreboot was change to Canoeboot for any other reason, I just want to know if I was mistaken when I thought I was installing Libreboot which, unless I'm mistaken, for this model it could be just a branding difference being the code the exact same.
I, really, really, don't mind if the change was made by someone that supports Canoeboot over Libreboot. In my opinion, it is not needed to impose one over the other in this particular case, and I really really do not want to start a fight with anyone. Again I think enough has been written bout that. If someone notice that I'm misunderstanding something, please share a link with useful information instead, a forum post for example.
I must say that I respect Leah and her work. I think that we are all passionate about our ideals and believe, I'm always happy to see her post on this forum even after all the discussions. And I hope she is reading this post as well. And I'm just hoping that we can all, including her of course be professionals and not to take anything personal. I can ensure every one I'm not.
Again I don't want to start a fight, but I also noticed that the changes I submitted to the Libreboot site to include the instructions to install Trisquel, were deleted as well. I'll be sending a message on the Libreboot mailing list as well, but if Leah could see this message and let me know here that will be awesome as well. I'll report back if I know of anything before that. Thank you.
Canoeboot.
Libreboot added nonfree code.
It is against the Community Guidelines.
"The manuals we distribute will not recommend or suggest non-free software."
So you are saying that the official Trisquel position now is that this forum will ONLY support systems with known, un-patched CPU vulnerabilities via disabled microcode updates?
Seems like a bridge too far, and like something that could invite liability.
"un-patched CPU vulnerabilities via disabled microcode updates?"
Isn't this what Wikipedia explains what Linux-libre does?:
"Linux-libre does not suggest the user install CPU microcode update bundles, since the code is proprietary.[21] Microcode update bundles have been used in the mainline Linux kernel version, among other things, to mitigate hardware vulnerabilities."
>"Linux-libre does not suggest the user install CPU microcode update bundles"
I'm sure you are right. Seems like each user has to make their own decision. Not all are going to be in agreement with Stallman that there is a free software difference between default microcode and updated microcode. In the end, all are non-free. We are not required to all agree with Stallman on every point of minutia. I think @jxself has sometimes given the example of one of the PDP-10's where CPU microcode was completely user programmable, as an example of actual software freedom.
I am a translator!
I don't recall any detail but I remember reading explanations about the Trisquel kernel including mitigations of security issues that people claim to be fixed by microcode updates. So it does not look like anyone here is suggesting to ignore security issues.
The GNU FSDG don't require that you have an entirely free system, just to only distribute and only suggest installing free software. Canoeboot does this, and I am not aware that this would make using Trisquel with Canoeboot insecure.
Libreboot claims to promote free software but suggests installing any non-free software that is necessary to make your hardware entirely functional and for which there is no properly working free software replacement. To me, the appreciation of properly working is largely subjective (like, is a graphics card properly working without hardware accelation?), and Libreboot encourages people to install non-free software without even thinking about it.
The issue of promoting free software while users's hardware has problems to work that way is not ignored by the GNU project, there is even the suggestion at https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/install-fest-devil to deal with it in some educational way.
I've just read this, and if this is Stallman's view on installing non-free drivers then Stallman appears to be a lot more relaxed on the subject than many of our Trisquel forum members:
>"My new idea is that the install fest could allow the devil to hang around, off in a corner of the hall, or the next room. (Actually, a human being wearing sign saying “The Devil,” and maybe a toy mask or horns.) The devil would offer to install nonfree drivers in the user's machine to make more parts of the computer function, explaining to the user that the cost of this is using a nonfree (unjust) program."
>"The install fest would tolerate the devil's presence but not officially sponsor the devil, or publicize the devil's availability. Therefore, the users who accept the devil's deal would clearly see that the devil installed the nonfree drivers, not the install fest. The install fest would not be morally compromised by the devil's actions, so it could retain full moral authority when it talks about the imperative for freedom."
>"I remember reading explanations about the Trisquel kernel including mitigations of security issues that people claim to be fixed by microcode updates"
Yes and no. Some spectre and meltdown mitigations (and the other vulnerabilities like these) are included in the kernal, and are not non-free. However, the security mitigations that only come from Intel with Intel's microcode updates would not be included.
I just ran spectre-meltdown-checker to see if there are still vulnerabilities on my computer. It reported in the summary everything was okay to my surprise. Is there any other kernel checkers?
Excellent, that was exactly what I wanted to know. I was sure it was the other way around, but I'm happy to know.
Please correct me if mistaken, but I'm pretty sure this model (chrombook kevin) does not require any "micro codes" (sorry I really don't know what I'm talking about). So in this specific case Libreboot and Canoeboot would be the same.
I do believe is good to promote the correct name that follow the trisquel's community guidelines for sure.
Thank you.
Now I see, looking at https://canoeboot.org/ it says:
Canoeboot is a special fork of Libreboot, maintained in parallel to it by the same developer (Leah Rowe), who maintains both projects. Canoeboot removes all binary blobs from coreboot, thereby providing a fully Free Software coreboot distro, unlike Libreboot which has a more pragmatic Binary Blob Reduction Policy
OK, sounds good. Thank you for the clarification.
Its still better to use libreboot than the stock bios even freedom wise.
There is far more libre code in libreboot than in the stock bios.
Thus, while it not free enough for the FSF, its still miles better *IF* you have to choose between stock bios and libreboot is the other option.
OK, I just find my answer about why the instructions that I added to install trisquel in the libreboot page were deleted here:
https://codeberg.org/libreboot/lbwww/commit/fb174b833b4ce1d61e74854e5329342c374e26c4
EDIT: Woops! I meant to use this link https://codeberg.org/canoeboot/cbwww/commit/4176e9c65616a51b182105ad3667624e1bc44e6b
That's where Leah explains it, not the other one.
I think it's reasonable, unlike the Debian instructions mine linked the manual at the Trisquel wiki, and I agree that some one interested on Trisquel will look in the forum. I won't use the "g" word mentioned by Leah because I don't want to promote it xD, I would have used: anyone can "duckduckgo" the instructions if they are interested on Trisquel.
BTW a friend of mine point me to gnuboot:
https://www.gnu.org/software/gnuboot/index.html
Chromebook kevin is not listed as supported yet.