Trisquel 9 Ready For Development And Testing

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jxself
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Iscritto: 09/13/2010

From the weekly Freedom Fridays development meeting in #trisquel-deve on irc.freenode.net we have news that Trisquel 9 aka "Etonia" can now be debootstraped normally, so you can build your own Trisquel 9 development/testing environment. Rubén installed it on a laptop for a test and got as far as to have a working desktop environment, so all the basics are in place. He had to use a Trisquel 8 kernel, though, as that is still missing.

If you don't want to install the Trisquel 8 kernel on Trisquel 9 there are also mine, at https://jxself.org/linux-libre/

jxself
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Iscritto: 09/13/2010

er; that should be #trisquel-dev

jxself
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Iscritto: 09/13/2010

As you can see from http://archive.trisquel.info/trisquel/dists/etiona/InRelease Etonoia is currently only being built for amd64 and i386 but my understanding is that other architectures like ARM as well as ppc64el for IBM POWER8 and above like Talos II are on their way in the future.

jxself
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Iscritto: 09/13/2010

An important task is to test ubuntu-mate 18.04 and see what can we incorporate from it, how does it compare to Trisquel 8 desktop, suggestions of new preinstalled packages, or config settings, etc.

loldier
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Iscritto: 02/17/2016

"suggestions of new preinstalled packages"

yle-dl (download Yle Areena streams)

https://aajanki.github.io/yle-dl/index-en.html

It's included on OpenBSD, Fedora as far as I know of. It can be installed from the source or using pip, but nothing beats the convenience of a precompiled package.

Malsasa
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Iscritto: 12/01/2016

Great news! Thanks for informing.

davidpgil
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Iscritto: 08/26/2015

I would love it if Trisquel would come preconfigured with very good audio production settings/ software. I found recently that Ubuntu Studio really shines in this way, especially in the very latest version.

So, I'd like things related to JACK, Ardour, LMMS, Carla, Cadence, etc should exist in the repo.

chaosmonk

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Iscritto: 07/07/2017

> I would love it if Trisquel would come preconfigured with very good
> audio production settings/ software.

I don't think that it should by default, since this would mean things
like a low-latency kernel, which most users do not need, and JACK
instead of pulseaudio, which most users *really* do not need.

I have thought about the idea of a separate Trisquel Studio flavor
analogous to Ubuntu Studio. One problem is that Trisquel is based on
Ubuntu's two-year release cycle plus a delay. Musicians generally want
newer software than this. Ubuntu Studio is based on Ubuntu's short term
releases, so it has a six-month release cycle, but Trisquel doesn't have
short term releases based on Ubuntu's.

It looks like Ubuntu Studio does have a backports PPA[1] from which we
could bring in some newer packages, except that the PPA only supports
LTS versions of Ubuntu for three years, so it's too late to do this for
Trisquel 8, but might be an option for Trisquel 9.

KXStudio has a similar PPA from which we might at least want to bring in
Cadence, Catia, and some plugins.

Then we could borrow Ubuntu Studio's default configuration (if they have
JACK working out-of-the box even with laptop soundcards I'll be very
impressed) and either build Abrowser with JACK support[2] or run it with
apulse so that it does not require pulseaudio.

Since it sounds like you're using Ubuntu Studio, can you tell me
- Are you using the LTS version based on 18.04, or the newest version
based on 18.10?
- Did JACK work out of the box (especially if you tried it with a
laptop's soundcard as opposed to an audio interface)?
- Do they use a JACK-pulseaudio bridge, or do they avoid pulseaudio
entirely?
- It doesn't look like Ubuntu's repo or Ubuntu Studio's PPA include
Cadence and Catia. Do they use qjackctl, or do they have another
graphical tool for configuring and routing JACK?

[1] https://launchpad.net/~ubuntustudio-ppa/+archive/ubuntu/backports
[2] https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=783733

strypey
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Iscritto: 05/14/2015

I agree with chaosmonk that Trisquel is intended as a common-or-garden desktop distro, not a multimedia studio. But I would love to see an up-to-date libre distro (or flavour) targeting the needs of the multimedia producers who use distros like UbuntuStudio, Artix, or AV Linux.

Historically there were two FSF-endorsed distros that aimed to provide a multimedia studio out-of-the-box. One was Musix which was recently retired from the list, as it's no longer in active development. The other is Dyne:Bolic, which hasn't had a release since 2011. The Dyne folks have been working on Heads (a libre replacement for the Tails live distro), which last had a beta release a year ago. The release announcement said:
> "probably the final release before heads is ready to apply for the GNU free distribution list"

... which made me think that if and when Heads is added to the list, it would be a replacement for Dyne:Bolic. But it looks like Dyne expressed an intention to release a new version of Dyne:Bolic based off Devuan, since it's listed under "upcoming distributions" here:
https://devuan.org/os/partners/devuan-distros

chaosmonk

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Iscritto: 07/07/2017

> ... which made me think that if and when Heads is added to the list, it
> would be a replacement for Dyne:Bolic.

Heads and Dyne:Bolic have very different purposes. I don't really see
one as a replacement for the other.

> But it looks like Dyne expressed
> an intention to release a new version of Dyne:Bolic based off Devuan,

That would be awesome! Do you have link to this info?

chaosmonk

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Iscritto: 07/07/2017

> That would be awesome! Do you have link to this info?

Duh. You did provide a link. Sorry for not reading.

davidpgil
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Iscritto: 08/26/2015

I believe that Trisquel right now has an opportunity to be taken more seriously as a distro creatives could depend on. The most problematic aspect I have seen with GNU/Linux is the audio config requirements. Anyone can use an audio optimized distro, but people who need audio to "just work" cannot use any distro. Now that KXStudio is asleep and Musix is dead, I think its a very natural step for Trisquel to pick up where those two left off, being that I believe Trisquel is the most popular Libre Distro.

If you just need a basic distro to do anything, there are plenty of other options available right now. As a creative who not onlky codes, creates music and visual art, I see some apps starting to really listen to us and now I see them flourishing. I want the same for Trisquel if I can help it.

davidpgil
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Iscritto: 08/26/2015

I lost track of this thread. I will at least bother to reply here.

>> - Are you using the LTS version based on 18.04, or the newest version
based on 18.10?
I'm actually using Ubuntu Studio 19.04. I am trying to get the most productivity out of my workstation at the moment. Would LOVE to have a working Trisquel setup, even if I have to go install the 18.04 based Ubuntu thread.

>> - Did JACK work out of the box (especially if you tried it with a
laptop's soundcard as opposed to an audio interface)?
- Do they use a JACK-pulseaudio bridge, or do they avoid pulseaudio
entirely?
On Ubuntu Studio 19.04 JACK works out of the box very well.

>> - It doesn't look like Ubuntu's repo or Ubuntu Studio's PPA include
Cadence and Catia. Do they use qjackctl, or do they have another
graphical tool for configuring and routing JACK?
They use Ubuntu Studio Controls, which I believe works in the place of Catia, minus the extended features of that app, like patching, etc.

chaosmonk

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Iscritto: 07/07/2017

> I'm actually using Ubuntu Studio 19.04. I am trying to get the most
> productivity out of my workstation at the moment. Would LOVE to have a
> working Trisquel setup, even if I have to go install the 18.04 based Ubuntu
> thread.

My hope is that by backporting newer versions of the most popular
multimedia software we can keep Trisquel up-to-date where it matters for
artists while still having a LTS base. Musicians probably care what
version of Ardour they have. They probably don't care what version of
system-config-printer they have as long as it works.

Btw, did you get my email?

davidpgil
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Iscritto: 08/26/2015

Yes. I responded with my communication info.

Magic Banana

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Iscritto: 07/24/2010

That is great news! :-)

A suggestion of a small package that appeals to those who like podcasts: https://soundconverter.org to easily batch convert audio/video files in any GStreamer-supported format to Ogg Vorbis or Opus or...

zangisharp
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Iscritto: 01/08/2019

Great news,

How can I install Trisquel 9 for testing?

Thanks.

chaosmonk

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Iscritto: 07/07/2017

> How can I install Trisquel 9 for testing?

I'm not sure whether this is the best way, but I was able to install it
on a spare laptop by doing a netinstall of Trisquel 8, editing
/etc/apt/sources.list and changing "flidas" to "etiona", and running

$ sudo apt update
$ sudo apt install perl-modules-5.26 # to resolve a package conflict when upgrading
$ sudo apt upgrade
$ sudo apt dist-upgrade

jxself
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Iscritto: 09/13/2010

Another option can be to use debootstrap to install it onto a spare partition. Install a kernel, configure GRUB and ta da.

nadebula.1984
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Iscritto: 05/01/2018

A good idea. I just want to try Trisquel 9 on a Skylake desktop to see how well are the graphics and audio (both require certain non-free blobs) supported by a free/libre distribution. Another option is the deblobbed Debian (without any non-free firmware), but I may want to try both.

zangisharp
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Iscritto: 01/08/2019

Thanks.

I downloaded the netinstall but its not working I have an error during installation "Loading libc6-udeb failed for unknown reasons. Aborting"

:(

chaosmonk

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Iscritto: 07/07/2017

> I tried to download the netinstall but its not working I have an error
> during installation "Loading libc6-udeb failed for unknown reasons.

Yeah, that's a bug. I guess the fixed ISOs either haven't made it to the
download page or haven't made it to all mirrors. Here's[1] what I used.
The "install in text mode" option is the same as a netinstall.

http://jenkins.trisquel.info/makeiso/iso/trisquel_8.0_amd64.iso

chaosmonk

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Iscritto: 07/07/2017

Icewm running on Trisquel 9

screenFetch-2019-05-04_22-48-10.png
Beformed
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Iscritto: 01/12/2017

For those like me that have no idea what debootstrap is : https://wiki.debian.org/Debootstrap

Pablo G

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Iscritto: 05/16/2012

Good news !

I'll have a look Ubuntu Mate in an unused laptop.

davidel
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Iscritto: 03/25/2013

I like to have a working version of minitube

Sasaki
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Iscritto: 08/11/2014

Hi ! It's the same for me : I could never install a working version of minitube. Musictube would also be a good idea.

chaosmonk

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Iscritto: 07/07/2017

> I could never install a working version of minitube.

It's been a year or so since I tried to get Minitube working, so my
memory is a little hazy, but IIRC the problem had to do with Minitube's
use of Google's API. From [1]:

> Google is now requiring an API key in order to access YouTube Data web
> services. Create a "Browser Key" at
> https://console.developers.google.com and enable the Youtube Data API.
>
> The key must be specified at compile time as shown below.
> Alternatively Minitube can read an API key from the GOOGLE_API_KEY
> environment variable.

The developer presumably has their own API key with which they compile
their binaries, so their prebuilt binaries probably work, but in order
for a user or distro to build it themselves they need their own API key.
When Google made this change, it broke the versions of Minitube in
distros' repositories, because it would get built without an API key and
then wouldn't work.

I remember reading that Debian at one point got Minitube working by
using their own API key. A problem with this approach is that when a
Debian user uses Minitube Google will know from the API key that they
are a Debian user, which it seems to me would expose the user to
fingerprinting. Trisquel has few users compared to Debian, only a subset
of whom would use Minitube, so to me it seems like this approach would
put Trisquel users at risk of fingerprinting. If you build Minitube
yourself using your own API key then the fingerprinting will be even
more precise, which is a problem since freedom 1 requires your to be
able to build from source.

I recommend using a program that uses youtube-dl or Invidious's API
instead of Google's API. GTK-Youtube-Viewer[2] has similar functionality
to Minitube.

[1] https://github.com/flaviotordini/minitube
[2] https://github.com/trizen/youtube-viewer

strypey
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Iscritto: 05/14/2015

It's only been a year or so since the beginning of development on Etiona was announced:
https://trisquel.info/en/trisquel-90-development-plans

... and already we have a testing release, this is great news! My testing and hacking time is now going to be split between figuring out if I can successfully install Libreboot on my x20, getting the librem.one services working on both my laptops and Android, and now testing Etiona as well! It's going to be a busy month :)

Pep
Pep
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Iscritto: 08/20/2016

Here the list of issues I encountered while migrating to Trisquel 9:

-libc6-dev-armhf-cross dependencies issue
Solution: https://askubuntu.com/questions/1079797/how-do-i-fix-an-error-with-libc6-dev-armhf-cross-in-ubuntu-18-04-when-trying-to/1079855

-Trisquel 8 gtk-theme doesn't display scrollbar. I had to switch theme in lxde (adwaita)

strypey
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Iscritto: 05/14/2015

Does Ubuntu 16.04 include exFAT support out-of-the-box? If not, could exfat-utils and exfat-fuse be added to Trisquel 9 to allow it to work with large SDcards formatted with exFAT? See:
https://trisquel.info/en/forum/trouble-mounting-sdcard-solved

amuza
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Iscritto: 02/12/2018

I hope it is not a problem to use this thread as a Trisquel 9 Wish List.

I don't like the panel on the bottom having second-floor buttons. I think mouse users would go quicker having all the buttons down there, at the very bottom, despite they had to go smaller.

I might be going too far with this whish list, but as Trisquel helps users to protect their freedom, I think it would be nice to include programs that let users communicate without centralized services. So I would like to see programs like Retroshare, Jami and Tox in Trisquel 9. Other options could be FreeNet, ZeroNet, Patchwork(SSB), Bitmessage...

I would also like Trisquel9 to include TorBrowser.

strypey
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Iscritto: 05/14/2015

amuza:
> I think it would be nice to include programs that let users communicate without centralized services.

I definitely see the value of a fully libre distro that made decentralization and anonymity a focus. Have you looked at Heads, a fully libre spin on Tails?:
https://heads.dyne.org/

I'm not sure that's the right focus for Trisquel though. My understanding of Trisquel's goal is a distro with the lowest possible barrier to entry for new GNU/Linux users. A lot the programs you mention are bleeding edge and very difficult to use. Of those you mention, I've tested Freenet, BitMessage, Jami, and Tox. They all have a lot of potential, but I wouldn't recommend them to a non-geek yet.

Another thing to be aware of is the different between the aspirations of a project, and the current reality of the software. For example:

"Neither the Tox protocol nor the implementation have undergone peer review, and its exact security properties and network behaviour are not well-understood, yet. We are actively working on improving that situation. Until said peer review, Tox is not recommended for use cases that require proven, high-assurance security. If you find any potential security issues, don’t hesitate to report them on the bug tracker."
https://toktok.ltd/

I would prefer not to see apps like these bundled with Trisquel until all the code they depend on has passed at least one security audit, and their UX is friendly enough for the average user.

davidel
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Iscritto: 03/25/2013

You can use the tor network using GNU IceCat web browser, or you can download the TorBrowser from the web site. Would be a waste of time packaging TorBrowser because new version are released too quickly.

eric23
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Iscritto: 06/30/2017

What should we install to get networking working? I am at the stage where I can boot into Trisquel 9, but get no networking. I could use either wifi or wired but neither work.

And every time I boot the filesystem check fails.

chaosmonk

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Iscritto: 07/07/2017

> What should we install to get networking working?

$ sudo apt install network-manager

If using the command line, use

$ nmtui

to connect. If if using a desktop environment or window manager with a
systray

$ sudo apt install network-manager-gnome

and run

$ nm-applet

or add nm-applet to your list of startup commands.

I find on Trisquel 9 that after installing NetworkManager hangs for five
minutes on "A start job is running for raise network interfaces" while
booting. To fix this, edit "/etc/dhcp/dhclient.conf" as root and change
"timeout 300" to "timeout 15"

> I am at the stage where
> I can boot into Trisquel 9, but get no networking. I could use either
> wifi or wired but neither work.

I'm surprised wired doesn't work, but if you can't connect to the
Internet then you'll have to install network-manager offline. On another
computer, download the deb file from here:

https://packages.ubuntu.com/bionic/amd64/network-manager/download

copy it over to your Trisquel 9 system, and run

$ sudo dpkg -i /path/to/network-manager-gnome_1.8.10-2ubuntu1_amd64.deb

If you are missing dependencies then you'll need to download those from
packages.ubuntu.com and install them with dpkg as well. Then connect
with "nmtui" and install network-manager-gnome with apt if desired.

> And every time I boot the filesystem check fails.

Not sure how to fix that, sorry.

eric23
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Iscritto: 06/30/2017

I am not sure what is happening to the wired connection. Maybe my hardware is just failing. In Trisquel 8 the lights blink on, but I can't connect anymore. In Trisquel 9 upon entering boot up of the kernel the lights stop I think.

After installing linux-modules-extra for the Trisquel 9 kernel I was able to get my wireless working in a terminal using that nmtui-connect command.

strypey
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Iscritto: 05/14/2015

eric23:
> I am not sure what is happening to the wired connection. Maybe my hardware is just failing. In Trisquel 8 the lights blink on, but I can't connect anymore. In Trisquel 9 upon entering boot up of the kernel the lights stop I think.

Have you tried making some boot USBs of other distros and testing the wired network connection on them? If you test on a number of OS and can't get a wired connection on any of them, there's a good chance that either your NIC card, the jack, or the cable is failing.

dctrud (non verificato)
dctrud

Just a note that I've started updating a few package helpers so I could sbuild some things for my laptop which is running etiona now. I've made some merge requests on the trisquel GitLab instance... they may not be perfect but I've been able to sbuild working debs for etiona with these changes.

https://devel.trisquel.info/trisquel/package-helpers/merge_requests

MD. SHAHIDUL ISLAM
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Iscritto: 10/14/2015

I have installed trisquel 9.
I am missing these packages:
pidgin, libpurple, lightdm-gtk-greeter, redshift, abrowser, gnome-menus,...

dctrud

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Iscritto: 09/06/2019

For anyone trying/testing trisquel 9, Jenkins doesn't seem to be building all of the working package-helpers, so I have put my local builds of everything that's working for me here: https://www.randomroad.net/trisquel_deb/

They're not signed, no release file etc. so you likely shouldn't trust them, but might be useful if you are trying out 9.0 / want to contribute to testing things.