3G modems coming integrated with Next Gen Intel Atom (for real this time)

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Chris

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So there has been some speculation in the past on the integration of 3G modems in CPUs there is new news that its actually happening and not secretly either. I haven't read up on it much yet either, but I'm imagining this will be pretty obvious once released. Also to note is that the 3G is in the SOC and I'm assuming not on the CPU itself. I'm unsure about the antennas although we'll have to wait and see. In theory it might work without them, but I'm thinking probably not as it would reduce reception.

http://hothardware.com/news/intel-announces-first-atom-soc-with-integrated-lte-modem

tomlukeywood
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dose anyone know if its possible to make your own
motherboards, cpu's, gpu's, HDD's, etc

how would you get the machines to make computer hardware?

this seems like the only answer
i don’t think we can just trust intel or amd
and hope for the best

rmmmusial
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Semiconductor fab shops require ungodly amounts of money.

"Fabs require many expensive devices to function. Estimates put the cost of building a new fab over one billion U.S. dollars with values as high as $3–4 billion not being uncommon. TSMC invested $9.3 billion in its Fab15 300 mm wafer manufacturing facility in Taiwan.[1]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semiconductor_fabrication_plant

And that is just on the hardware side. Then you need to staff it with people, then you need to R&D your chipset, then you need to work on an instruction set. Is it going to be a new instruction set? Are you going to clone an existing instruction set? What kind of patents are you going to be possibly infringing on?

It'd be nice if the libre community could compete with AMD and Intel, but, at this point it isn't realistic, at all.

tomlukeywood
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is there any way it could be cheaper if you were willing to have lower spec chips?
like the arm cpu's

even if you had to put up with a 10 khz cpu
it would beable to run very simple dos like systems
and it would be a start

rmmmusial
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I don't think lowering the specs would bring down cost all that much, and it wouldn't achieve any real goal. You're still going to have to buy the machines, the clean rooms, R&D, and all of that. Plus a 10 khz cpu would be next to worthless (I know you were picking an absurdly low clock rate on purpose), even a 486 33MHz DX chipset is next to worthless now. Why go through all the trouble when you can get RYF certified systems like the Libreboot X60? Those actually have competitive specs and they don't have these problems.

What actually makes a difference is using 100% free distros. Refusing to buy hardware that doesn't respect your freedom. Intel and AMD already have the power to make chips that respect your freedom, so either buy old stock, or refuse to upgrade. And learn to reverse engineer this garbage so you can work on projects like libreboot and linux-libre.

quantumgravity
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"Why go through all the trouble when you can get RYF certified systems like the Libreboot X60?"

Hmm have you checked the whole X60 if it's mistreating you on hardware level? Every circuit, chip?
I haven't.
And you can't run around with a X60 for the next 20 years; the digital society we live in evolves very quickly, and life will demand more up-to-date specs;
Sooner or later, we'll have to buy a new system, and this will be a real problem, as the post of chris shows once again.

rmmmusial
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When I said it wouldn't be worth the trouble I was responding specifically to the suggestion...

"even if you had to put up with a 10 khz cpu it would beable to run very simple dos like systems and it would be a start"

Let's say it cost $5 billion to build a fab to produce a top of the line, multicore, x86_64 clone..
or it cost only $900 million to build a fab to produce a completely obsolete chip like a 10 khz chip.

No business, bank, investor, or charity alive is going to give you $900 million to make an obsolete chip (0.0% chance) when you can just go out and buy old chips anyway. You've got a much better chance (and when I say much better, I mean maybe a 0.5% chance) of getting the $5 billion to make an actual workable chip.

Also, no, I haven't checked every circuit and chip of the X60, but somewhere, eventually, you have to trust someone. I trust the FSF's certification process. If you're insisting on building every little part yourself, you'll never get anything done. Because you'll have to use an existing system to build the tools that you're going to use. How do I know the systems you used to build your new systems are trustworthy?

quantumgravity
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"Also, no, I haven't checked every circuit and chip of the X60, but somewhere, eventually, you have to trust someone. I trust the FSF's certification process."

That's obviously a giant misunderstanding:
The FSF's certification process is about *software freedom*, a crucial and neccessary aspect of a pc respecting human rights, not mistreating its users,
but it's _not_ the only one.
It doesn't protect users from hardware backdoors, for instance. As far as i know, stallman adresses the issue with the term "malicious circuits" .

It's true, we have to trust somebody to some extent. At the moment, we're trusting countless big ass companies which aren't trustworthy in the slightest.
Consider a future in which 3d printers are really elaborate, making it actually possible to print our own hardware.
It would not be impossible to check if the printer is really printing what you want;
You could just do a lot of tests and look at the result; maybe some institutes like university would have to help out.

rmmmusial
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"That's obviously a giant misunderstanding:
The FSF's certification process is about *software freedom*"

No, RYF is a hardware and software process...

http://www.fsf.org/news/endorsement-criteria
http://libreplanet.org/wiki/Group:Hardware/Certification_criteria

You must be able to run free software on every layer, and there must be no spying. In this case, if the 3g modem runs free software, and doesn't spy, then this is truly a feature and not an anti-feature.

"but it's _not_ the only one.
It doesn't protect users from hardware backdoors, for instance."

FSF's RYF certification certainly does cover this...

http://libreplanet.org/wiki/Group:Hardware/Certification_criteria#No_spying

Legimet
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"However, there is an exception for secondary embedded processors. The exception applies to software delivered inside auxiliary and low-level processors and FPGAs, within which software installation is not intended after the user obtains the product. This can include, for instance, microcode inside a processor, firmware built into an I/O device, or the gate pattern of an FPGA. The software in such secondary processors does not count as product software."

That should explain everything.

ericfontaine
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"Hmm have you checked the whole X60 if it's mistreating you on hardware level? Every circuit, chip?"

There are 3 general approaches to security: Security by Correctness, Security by Isolation, and Security by Obscurity. Security by correctness of every component is extremely difficult to achieve, due to falliablity of humans and having to trust every part of the implementation and production and delivery. Security by obscurity on the other hand is discouraged as a primary mechanism because if the design is ever revealed, then the whole system can be comprimised. But regarding hardware, security by isolation is much more realistic, as it is not necessary to verify the correctness of "every circuit, every chip", but only verify the isolation mechanism and strictly limit the manner in which individudal componets can communitate.

It will be a long time before we can achieve verifiably fully libre chips, but a much more realistic short-term goal can be fully libre board and fully libre boot & crypto core (likely running on an fpga) that is really simple, dumb, and slow, running a minimal hypervisor, which would control a faster (but proprietary) application processor at a lower privelege level as a subservient coprocessor.

On a side note, I have one or thoses Novena computers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novena_%28computing_platform%29) which is a full arm labtop/desktop w/fpga built by hackers with all the schematics for the motherboard released under open source license, which I can look at right now. I am also typing this on a X60s libreboot machine. I've also tried out Qubes OS, which tries to implement security by isolation by running the networking code in a seperate vm from the vm that is able to access storage, and then each application can run in another a seperate vm. Of course none of these are the full solution, as for instance it is possible that my flash rom is evil and has intercepted my flashing of libreboot or in the case of novena that the manufacturers deviated from the schematics or delivered me a comprimised board, but these are the types of steps that are in the right direction. And with consumer 3D printed circuitboards, it may even soon be possible to print your own minimal trusted motherboard as a base which you then solder a trusted fpga core and proprietary cpu and rest of the proprietary components on.

marioxcc
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>dose anyone know if its possible to make your own motherboards, cpu's, gpu's, HDD's, etc

Well, “to make” is open to interpretation. There is no single company (let alone individual) which does everything from the extraction of raw materials (I.e: mineral ores, raw petroleum, and so on) and outputs a finished CPU, GPU, hard disk, motherboard, and so on, so in this sense nobody and no company is solely responsible for “making” a chip or motherboard.

There is a lot of companies and productive activities involved in the production of semiconductors. I don't know the whole chain. You are likely interested in the last links: The design and manufacturing of integrated circuits (especially CPUs), and the assembly of them into printed circuit boards.

As mentioned above, the equipment to manufacture a CPU (whether comparable to an ARM, Intel or AMD CPU) is extremely expensive and takes people and knowledge to operate so it's not feasible for an individual to turn a silicon ingot (and all of the other already highly processed materials it takes) into a CPU. There are however, semiconductor companies that can be hired to manufacture integrated circuits given a design (I don't know how costly it is and what the minimum volumes are). Take a look at the lowRISC project; it seems like they will hire one such company to manufacture the CPU. They use the RISC-V instruction set architecture. RISC-V is a project about developing an instruction set architecture, implementation of it and related software (emulator, compiler, Linux port, etcetera). It seems a promising project. However, unfortunately both have the open source attitude.

Manufacturing a motherboard is very different. It's a printed circuit board with macroscopic integrated circuits and connectors. Depending on the sophistication of a PCB it may be possible for an individual to take a blank PCB, etch, cut and drill it (not all are drilled), and solder the components. Through-hole components are easy to solder but most non-power components are surface-mount which are much harder to solder or impossible without specialized equipment. The situation is the same with masking and etching. However, there are plenty of companies that manufacture PCBs with the customer's design (Search for “printed circuit board manufacturer”) and those are well within the reach of individuals.

There are also FPGAs. They can be used to can implement CPU; however, it's costlier, slower and less efficient than a dedicated CPU. It seems that, with the current state of affairs it's not possible to avoid proprietary software when doing FPGA development. I don't have experience in FPGA development so the previous statement may be incorrect.

Also, you can make toy computers with low level integrated circuits which contain a few logic gates like the 4000 and 7400 series. There was a time when computers were made like this. I think that you can get clock speeds of 100 KHz easily. I'm mentioning this to bring some insight and as a curiosity. Modern software requires much more speed that what you can realistically expect to get with toy computers like these.

All of the above considerations don't take design into account. Designing digital integrated circuits involves several disciplines of knowledge and is also a huge task. One of those disciplines is computer architecture.

Your intention is laudable, but I think there are more effective ways in which you can contribute to free software: computer programming, graphic design, writing documentation, reporting bugs, buying free software compatible hardware whenever you need hardware, etcetera. Do what you like and know how to do and learn disciplines that will enable you to contribute in a future. You can also do any ethical economic activity that will give you money and then hire somebody to do any of the other activities mentioned in this paragraph; I think that you are very young, and if that is the case, I don't recommend the later point yet, and bear in mind that you still have plenty of time to learn (but don't waste it, either).

Regards.

hnasiet
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Like rmmmusial said it's close to impossible to make your own semiconductor technology, primarly because the tecnology used to make them is ultra expensive, micro and nano technology is not something you can do even if you win many lotteries, and even if you could make something it probably wouldn't be worth it. However if you are interested in doing it just for fun, I believe that low freq 8-bit processors are achievable.

muhammed
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These professors teach how to build computer hardware using only nand-gates. They also teach how to make operating systems and programs for the nand-gate computer.

http://nand2tetris.org/

I don't really know about computers. Could someone provide some insight about this?

marioxcc
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What kind of insight do you expect?. If you have any specific question try searching before asking here, and consider starting a new topic in the forum because this is already off-topic here. I think that all but the first post is on-topic in this thread.

muhammed
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Are nand-gate computers a viable potential replacement for contemporary computers?

lep
lep
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Honestly, I think it will be enough to respect Human Rights (HR).

http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/

We don't need more plants, what we need is to enforce the basic rights we are entitled with just because we are humans. I really think the solution will be found when we demand respect to HR.

It's up to the citizens of the world to not let HR be just a soaked paper, not just something our grandparents once wrote.

tomlukeywood
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true but as Intel's goal is profits and not human rights

i think we rely need to fight back with computers
made for the benefit of people and not the benefit of the few pepole doing harm to others

quantumgravity
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If the machines available don't respect human rights
and if we can't make our own, then
we have to stop using these machines to the extent possible.

That's a radical statement but it's logically consistent.

Jabjabs
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I completely agree. Over the last few years Intel had been on the edge, but now they are actively working against users. We have to find another hardware platform to work on. It's a simple statement with an incredibly large amount of work to achieve it.

tomlukeywood
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i hear that you can easily make a toy prosessor that would run at 100khz
source:
https://trisquel.info/en/forum/3g-modems-coming-integrated-next-gen-intel-atom-real-time#comment-65888

so what is the thing that stops you making a
1mhz prosessor or
100mhz prosessor?

what is the thing that suddenly make it so you have to buy
a 9 billion dollar cpu factory?

i think about 22mhz would be acceptable for modern computer use
you would have to make a new operating system for it
something like Kolibri OS
it would be-able to run a gui and some basic modern program like
a spreadsheet or powerpoint application or media player

Jodiendo
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tomlukeywood said:

i hear that you can easily make a toy prosessor that would run at 100khz

Tom

If you want a toy processor make sure it barks like a Dog to chase your cat and Has an embedded spell check software for the word "prosessor" like you wrote.

marioxcc
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>so what is the thing that stops you making a 1mhz prosessor or 100mhz prosessor?

Answer: the fact that IC likes the ones I mentioned have a low level of integration. This means that they are very simple and so you would need too many to make a CPU comparable to modern ones (The Wikipedia article on VLSI leaves a lot to be desired, but it will give you a basic idea. Also search for “very large scale integration” and “transistor count”). The amount of logic gates that you can get by using logic gates like the series I mentioned is very limited; it would get very expensive soon. Bear in mind that transistor counts of 10⁸ are common for modern CPU's. A lot of that is used for cache, however. Also, I think that a lot of transistors are used to support obsolete features in x86. With a slow processor you won't need nearly that much cache, and since you probably won't use x86 (because of patents an the aforesaid burden of obsolete features).

Also, the big size of these ICs limits their clock frequency because there is a big capacitance between tracks, pins and the transistor's gates and bodies (meaning that it takes current to charge and discharge them, and that current increases proportionately with frequency). As frequency increases, things behave increasingly as antennas and signals leak into adjacent components. For instance, you can connect an appliance to the domestic 60 Hz electric power supply without having special considerations for these effects, but you can see that special considerations are needed for things like Ethernet, just to name an example: the wires are twisted to reduce the interference and fading due to them acting as antennas, and also to maintain the correct impedance (See All About Circuits chapter Transmission Lines, especially sections 1, 2, 3 for a soft introduction to the topic of transmission lines and their characteristic impedance. For a more technical treatment see Telegrapher's equations in Wikipedia or in a specialized book).

Looking at some 4000 series datasheets I see that common logic gates (and, nor, nand) take around 10 transistors because they include some overhead for buffering (inverters at input and output, and they use complementary logic in between). Unbuffered versions would need 4 transistors less than buffered versions, with the same functionality at the digital level but less good electrical characteristics. This gives you an idea of the sophistication you can attain with something like the 4000 series compared to modern CPUs.

You seem to be using clock frequency as a measure of performance. For a given CPU, I think that the performance will scale approximately linearly with clock speed but the RAM and bus may increasingly behave as a bottleneck if the their clock speed is fixed and the clock speed of a CPU is increased (but I don't know how significant this effect is). However, in general it's not meaningful to compare different CPU with different microarchitectures (The design of the CPU) based on their clock speed. Believing otherwise is the megahertz or gigahertz myth (See megahertz myth).

Also, bear in mind that the maximum switching frequency of the transistors a CPU (considered individually) is lesser than that of the gates, which is lesser than the clock speed. That is because once the input is changed, you have to wait until the change propagates to the output and stabilizes before relying on it or changing the input again. Several slightly sophisticated techniques are used to reduce this delay. For an example of these techniques as found to speed up adders at the expense of using more transistors, search for “carry-lookahead adder” (The Wikipedia article does not gives a good idea).

Anyway, that was about building a CPU. Developing toy computers like the ones mentioned above won't help the situation of society. I mentioned this because you asked, but you don't need to design or manufacture a CPU in order to have a system fully compatible with free software;; at most, you'd need to integrate already manufactured integrated circuits into a board. Armory may be fully compatible with free software; I haven't checked, but it's just an example. You could (in principle, I don't suggest that you do this right now) likewise develop and crowd-finance a board fully compatible with free software if there isn't one already, or even use the commercial services provided for prototyping in order to make only a few boards without commercializing them.

Free software needs to become mainstream, or at least that mainstream software is compatible with it, so that those who we care about our freedom in our computing can use it and inter-operate with society (a useful condition, but not strictly necessary to live in society), so that it will spread even more. That's why it is important that free software that replaces already existing proprietary software for Windows also supports Windows (Such as office suites, communications software and so on): specifically, that eases transition to the individuals and to the society as a whole. An individual doesn't strictly needs to transition smoothly instead of a single big step, but more people will transition if they can do so smoothly. Society as a whole won't transition in a single big step. Toy computers may be fun to make and program (or frustrating) but I see very very unlikely that they will become mainstream and hence they do not provide a solution to the society about the problem of hardware being increasingly disrespectful of his user's computing rights.

Note that I'm not experienced or highly knowledgeable about these things. If you are really interested, you should verify the factual accuracy of what I said for yourself.

I hope that my time writing this was worth it, that is, that I have given you some answers and an idea of why making toy computers won't solve the problem. I took the time to write this long message because I think that your intentions are very good, but you have were on the wrong track with this. I insist in my advice, the one in the second to last paragraph (before “Regards.”) in my message above.

Regards.

SuperTramp83

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tomlukey I like your style! Extreme! Are you a TORrorist?
:P

tomlukeywood
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i sometimes use tor just to help the network be more anonymous

but as Samsung and the nsa know just about
everything about me as my family’s "smart tv"
is recording everything anyone in my house ses
and they have decided that a high resolution tv
and netflix
is more important than freedom

i have kind of excepted that close to everything i do is
monitored
and i have to wait a few years to move out

SuperTramp83

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sorry to hear that tom. You could wait for your parents to get asleep and then just take the stupid box and put in you car and then you go west until you reach a place like this.
Make sure to leave your door slightly (barely) open so when they wake up in the morning they'll blame it on the thieves.
ciao Tom!

marioxcc
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Haha, good joke, but I don't suggest to actually do that.

SuperTramp83

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wasn't joking!
:P

p.s - to extreme problems extreme measures..

Jabjabs
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Another less helpful solution, rip out the Wifi/Network module and microwave it for about 5-10 seconds. Put it back in and just claim it broke. No more spying that can call "home" and no more Netflicks.

Doesn't spread the right message but it would at least halt the functionality.

tomlukeywood
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i know if you put broken gpu's in microwaves
they can start working again
so this may not work...

SuperTramp83

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I heard about that and thought it was bull! Is it not??

Jeremiah Asbury
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@magicbanana

"I believe our current way of addressing the problem (down-voting the
posts until hidden and *not* answering) is good."
Why not just ban him, and any other users promoting misogyny,
pedophilia and murder? This vitriol could deter people from using the
forum, and it hijacks reasonable discussion on this mailing list.
(Down-voting does nothing to the mailing list, by the way.)

Magic Banana

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He already has at least two accounts on this forum ("chaosesqueteam" and "vPro"). I believe (but I may be wrong) he would create a third one if those two were deleted. It is easier to silently down-vote the offensive posts until hidden than to repetitively figure out what new nickname he chose. You are right to point out that down-voting has no effect on the mailing list. However, I believe (and, again, I may be wrong) most newcomers start contributing to the forum through the Web page and later decide to access it through the mailing list (or not).

Also, banning is a decision that would come from the Trisquel leader and not from the community. The Trisquel leader has better things to do than dealing with accusations of censorship (although it is not censorship: every community can decide its own rules and "chaosesqueteam" can express himself on his own server). Deciding what writings deserve a ban is a tough decision. Any such decision will necessarily generate tensions and large amounts of complaints (not only from who was banned).

Having moderators (with banning powers) would redirect the complaints/tension toward them. That is not much better. I believe the whole community had better deal with the problem. The hiding mechanism does just that and, now that the subsequent replies are not hidden, it does it well. However, and as I wrote in my previous post, it could be made a bit more "severe": a user with a negative average (i.e., who has received more down-votes than up-votes) would have his/her post hidden as soon as it gets -1 (instead of -3).

In summary:

  1. Banning is inefficient;
  2. Auto-regulation generates less tensions.
quantumgravity
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I'm not sure about the rating mechanism, but can't anybody with lots of accounts just upvote her own posts and circumvent the system that way?

Magic Banana

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Certainly. But that is quite some work just to get one's message showed. It may be possible to automate the process though...

ssdclickofdeath
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Suspicious activity like that would certainly be grounds for a ban, wouldn't it?
It should be easy to detect.

tonlee
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It is discouraging about hardware with free software, or open source. You notice that it cannot be done. You watch other get to know about the importance of free software on hardware, they have to realize it too. If knowledgeable people like thinkpenguin cannot get free software on hardware, then who can?

I already have posted about the lowrisc cpu. I did not get much response. My knowledge is, they want to build a board that in performance equals the pi 2. In a video I saw Bradbury say that not all hardware on the board will be open source on software.
If assumed that the cpu will be open source on software. Cannot a mainboard be made that is open source on software?

Can you double up on arm cpus until you get a performance that equals a duo core cpu, x86.

marioxcc
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>It is discouraging about hardware with free software, or open source. You notice that it cannot be done. [...] If knowledgeable people like thinkpenguin cannot get free software on hardware, then who can?

It can and has been done. Take a look at the Libreboot X200.

It's sad to see what the current state of affairs is, but that's not a reason to get discouraged. All on the contrary, it's a remainder that we need to take action for the situation to change. Buy hardware like this when you need hardware, donate to projects that develop free software (including those that replaces proprietary firmware, even donating to ethical commercial ones like Gluglug is a good idea) or contribute work to them. Spread the word about the ethical and practical problem of proprietary software and centralization, and how free software solves them and has other practical benefits (zero cost for licenses and reliability is an attractive practical point, but don't forge to say that those are secondary to the ethical benefits).

Remember, when Richard Stallman started the free software movement, free software didn't even exists as such and there wasn't a free operating system. He and other hackers began working to write a replacement for Unix (using Unix initially, and incrementally replacing Unix with what they had already, as far as I know).

tomlukeywood
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what exactly are you talking about?
you arnt very clear in what your trying to explain
or at as least not to me

"This is all to enforce America's feminist police state / empire world wide."
what do you mean by a feminist police state and empire?

you definitly dont seem to be treating women equal to men
why is this?

tomlukeywood
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do you not believe treating others with respect is a good thing?

if you were born a women how would you feel about this text you support?

Deuteronomy 22 28-29
“If a man meets a virgin who is not betrothed, and seizes her and lies with her, and they are found, then the man who lay with her shall give to the father of the young woman fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife, because he has violated her. He may not divorce her all his days."

which to me is saying that if you are raped by a man
you must be his wife and you have no say in it

do you think rape is immoral?

i think you should give everyone equal rights and equal respect
no matter what sex they are

onpon4
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Just ignore the troll.

By the way, that text from the Bible made perfect sense in the context of a society that considered women to be essentially property: it's a sort of "you break it, you buy it" law.

Another aside, one thing this troll alludes to is true: it's an injustice, and extremely dangerous, that possession of "child pornography" is a crime. This is true of any information or work. The official justification of it being evidence of a crime is absurd. (It could also be used to justify punishing businesses for recording surveillance footage when someone is stealing something!)

tomlukeywood
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you seem to be saying its ok to abuse women.

why do you think you should have more rights than
someone else just because there a women?

i feel you are basing most or all of your views on the old testament
do you not think it would be better to do things weather they are good or bad for the world
and not weather the old testament ses its ok?
tomlukeywood
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Joined: 12/05/2014

"Because when women have rights life is much less fun."

this is selfish
just because you might have less "fun"
is not a excuse for doing harm to others

the idea that you must abuse others to have a happy life
rely is wrong
lots(i say lots as i cant know for certain about everyone)
of pepole i know are perfectly happy without abusing others
and they do good to others and they don’t abuse them.

what is your specific reason for believing women should not
be equal to men?

"I hate feminism and feminists and am happy when they are killed."

i am a feminist
you would be happy if i were killed as i believe in equal rights
for men and women?

i highly disagree with your views but i would not be happy if you were dead.

danieru
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What part of

>Just ignore the troll.

you don't understand?

This only gives him more reasons to keep posting off-topic messages.

tomlukeywood
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Joined: 12/05/2014

i don’t think you should just ignore someone if you disagree with them
you should challenge there views

"This only gives him more reasons to keep posting off-topic messages."

this discussion should of been made in a off topic forum
true

onpon4
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Joined: 05/30/2012

I don't believe for a moment that chaosesqueteam actually believes men not being able to marry young girls (and women not being able to marry young boys, and women not being able to marry young girls, and men not being able to marry young boys) is some kind of conspiracy by women to enslave men. I've seen some pretty insane views, sure, but none as blatantly stupid as that. Support of a right to having sexual relations with children is something I'd believe to be genuine (it's probably the position of some people; I'm not sure). Belief in sexual relations with children being the norm which is actively suppressed by a conspiracy? No. He's just making stuff up hoping to get a response. That's what a troll is.

tomlukeywood
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Joined: 12/05/2014

i think his views are stupid
but i will still wait for his reply

Jeremiah Asbury
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Joined: 10/30/2013

@magicbanana

That makes sense, now that you have explained it.
Regards.

Jeremiah Asbury
Desconectado
Joined: 10/30/2013

I've done some research on misogyny in the Free Software/Open Source
communities, and have discovered that the user "chaosesqueteam" is a
known troll.

From this page: http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/MikeeUSA
"MikeeUSA is the pseudonym of an anti-feminist troll who periodically
targets the FLOSS communities, especially women's groups, with
extremely misogynistic language, calls to violence, and men's rights
content. He is regarded as a troll and a sexist within the masculist
movement as well."

akirashinigami

I am a member!

I am a translator!

Desconectado
Joined: 02/25/2010

Thanks for that information. It's obvious that he's a troll here, but I had no idea he had such a reputation.

Magic Banana

I am a member!

Desconectado
Joined: 07/24/2010

Reading some messages from that MikeeUSA aka Mikhail Kvaratskhelia (aka ...), I can see that he is "our" ChaosEsqueTeam aka vPro. Developing add-ons for FPS, obsessed with having sex with "young girls", constantly referring to Deuteronomy 22, justifying the murder of Nina Reiser, etc. If you want to see by yourself (advisory: hate speech that is even worse than what he writes on this forum), here are two examples:

In the past 10 years, this man (under various nicknames) was banned from SourceForge, Debian’s bug tracking system, Blogspot, DeviantArt, AdBrite, DynDNS, the Napster forums, ...: http://geekfeminism.org/2009/10/08/psa-mikeeusas-hate-speech-and-harassment/

I believe our current way of addressing the problem (down-voting the posts until hidden and *not* answering) is good. Maybe the system could be tougher, only requiring a -1 (rather than -3) to hide the post of a user with a negative average (more down-votes than up-votes overall).