TALOS II Secure Workstation, from Raptor Engineering

19 respostas [Última entrada]
Archetyp
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Joined: 06/15/2017

Recently, Raptor Engineering has launched a new series of workstation and server computers. These are high-end systems, using the libre IBM POWER9 architecture, and the boot firmware is entirely Free Software like Libreboot.

https://libreboot.org/news/talos.html

tonlee
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Joined: 09/08/2014

Can you say, what it is for?
https://secure.raptorcs.com/content/TL2B01/intro.html
Can it be a desktop computer? Would it be having a truck act as a car?
Is the quality such, it can run for decades?
It has no dvi port. Can you put a x86 pci graphic card on it?
What system do you install on it? Not x86 gnulinux?
If the board works for decades, will a software system be around?

Soon.to.be.Free
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Joined: 07/03/2016

>Can you say, what it is for?
https://secure.raptorcs.com/content/TL2B01/intro.html
Can it be a desktop computer? Would it be having a truck act as a car?

It's a high-end desktop and server board, so I'm pretty sure it'd be useful primarily those with computing-power-intensive needs. As such, it *is* a desktop computer (the workstation one, at least, is); whether it's having a "truck act as a car" is entirely dependent on whether you need it for editing hour-long films or just checking your e-mails, playing solitaire, and watching cat videos.

>Is the quality such, it can run for decades?

I don't see why not- it's certainly powerful enough to stay relevant for that long, short of quantum computing becoming mainstream. It's worth checking, but the price certainly points that way.

>What system do you install on it? Not x86 gnulinux?

Debian, probably- it has a port to the PowerPC architecture. In any case, x86 GNU/Linux will definitely not run on it.

>If the board works for decades, will a software system be around?

I'd say there more than likely will be: the Debian port to Apple's PowerPC Macs is still around (or was until recently) and they haven't even been on sale for a good decade or more. As with all free software, the port will be maintained as long as money and interest are available, which will no doubt be some time given the high cost and power of these boxes.

SuperTramp83

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Joined: 10/31/2014

>Would it be having a truck act as a car?

No.. but I'm sure it will be as expensive as a car :'(

J.B. Nicholson-Owens
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Joined: 06/09/2014

name at domain wrote:
> >Would it be having a truck act as a car?
>
> No.. but I'm sure it will be as expensive as a car :'(

$2300 for a single CPU Talos II bundle, according to
https://secure.raptorcs.com/content/TL2B01/purchase.html

I don't think it's fair to compare the Talos II (or the original Talos
offering) to an Asus or Gigabyte mainboard because those manufacturers sell
a lot more boards than Raptor. I'd expect the price to drop if Raptor could
secure the kinds of pre-sales Asus and Gigabyte commonly work in.

Also, principles cost money: if you want nonfree software-driven systems
and no opportunity to maintain your privacy there are plenty of inexpensive
options available.

onpon4
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Joined: 05/30/2012

Unfortunately, these are definitely upper-class prices. What you are talking about is literally just a motherboard and CPU; nothing else is included, not even a power supply or case. An actual Talos machine would be this one:

https://secure.raptorcs.com/content/TL2WK2/purchase.html

Note the cost: $6,750. For a single machine, that is monumentally expensive. That's literally roughly half my yearly salary. I would never buy a single computer at anywhere near that price. I'm sure many others would say the same thing.

Yeah, the price would go down with mass volume, but people like me can't be the driving force behind that. We just don't have that kind of money.

happy_gnu
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Joined: 08/06/2017

I know where you live might not be that much but 7 thousand in 6 months! Wow that is a lot where I live. A lot!

And yeah that is a monumental amount of money for a computer :/

To put it in perspective that is almost 5 years of minimum wage in my country :/

libreleah
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Joined: 04/03/2017

The original TALOS was 18,000 for the workstation I believe. So that 6750 is pretty low by comparison

SuperTramp83

I am a translator!

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Joined: 10/31/2014

yeah, leah, that's what I was referring to with my inane comment :)

libreleah
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Joined: 04/03/2017

IMO 6750 USD is better spent on the TALOS II than a new car.
Used cars are about 1000 USD on average. I got mine for 650 GBP (well, i bought it for my girlfriend for that amount, and she drives it)

Ronmamita
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Joined: 08/13/2017

The cost factors in most things in this monetary empire system, so that is to be expected. I find this offering very interesting, because:
1. WHY (or what is the IBM connection)??? When did these corporations get interested in the free source movement?

2. > $2300 for a single CPU Talos II bundle, according to
https://secure.raptorcs.com/content/TL2B01/purchase.html
I could attempt to install it in my older model, using the existing equipment (monitor, casing, fan & PwrSupply)

All to support the Free Source effort and have a Free Source home network.

Magic Banana

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Joined: 07/24/2010

Well, the "connection" is: IBM designed the processor. It is like Intel/AMD w.r.t. to your computers. Except that it is a totally different architecture, the Power architecture, that Trisquel 7 (and most GNU/Linux systems, and Windows, and current Mac OS) does not support.

Ronmamita
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Joined: 08/13/2017

So existing power supplies and sdd/hdd drives won't work?
No compatibility - even more interesting and expensive - LOL, I may have to chuck all digital paperweights and return to pen & paper.

Magic Banana

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Joined: 07/24/2010

The CPU architecture has nothing to do with the compatibility with peripherals. CPU with different architectures have different instruction sets. Programs compiled for one architecture do not work on another architecture. They must be compiled for that other architecture, to use its instructions.

muhammed
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Joined: 04/13/2013

off-topic, but I love that car

my dad's workplace had one when I was a kid

RMK
RMK
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Joined: 07/23/2016

I think this is actually very exciting news. This is a high-power system in which the mainboard and CPU will run with a full stack of libre software and firmware, and the price is much more reasonable than that of the original TALOS. Granted, it's still above many consumers' price points, but there are understandable reasons for that. For one, as mentioned upthread, Raptor doesn't have the sales volume that other manufacturers do. For another, it doesn't seem like Raptor intends for it to be a consumer product in the first place. Descriptors like "enterprise" and "workstation" imply that it's meant for business, not personal use (and for that matter, IBM's not shooting for the consumer price point with their CPU, either--they strategically exited the consumer market in the mid-2000s).

Ronmamita
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Joined: 08/13/2017

IBM showed their evil intentions many times...
Which has me curious about what they may potentially be hiding in firmware or CMOS?

Time4Tea
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Joined: 07/16/2017

I just saw the news article about this by the FSF and I agree this is very exciting! I would love to buy the single-cpu board for my home desktop, but it's probably doubtful that my wife would let me spend $2300 on it. :P

I sincerely wish these guys every success with it though, as this is surely the future for libre computing. If they can do a lower-end version at some point for <$1000, I will defo put it on my Christmas list.

Btw, does the linux-libre kernel work with this architecture?

tonlee
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Joined: 09/08/2014

I wrote the manufacturer. Asked them if they would contemplate an about 500usd mainboard. If they would cooperate with https://www.powerpc-notebook.org/en/.
No answer.

tonlee
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Joined: 09/08/2014

I got an answer from raptor.
I am covering the answer is a new post.