Trisquel Name (Terminology )

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SabirSaleem90
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Here is my some suggestions and advice would be appreciate.

as I observed and my some friends suggested me...:)

I see Trisquel Name is based on their beleive and their Celtic gods which is their Faith and believe but as Muslims in Islam it's forbidden to use any product which comes with other Religions God Name it's just for knowledge base.

My Friend is very keen of open source distro and like Free Software Movement (FSF) and using from Years Trisquel now understanding their name terminolgy he moved to using Ubuntu just because of Trisquel Name.

Well I am using this because of Open Source Free in Speech and like their contributions and work...

What I will suggest & advice here as a Muslim that use name which is outside the name of our Faith so all Religion of People can use that Product without concerned and worrying .....

Because first Priority is what our Religion teaches use afterwards our Privacy....:D

Hope Someone here will guide me if I am wrong or misunderstood.

Your Sincerely....

SabirSaleem90
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Joined: 10/03/2021

Because as I see all other distro's are not based upon Religions names like Ubuntu, Debian and so on but they are unfortunately non free we are not preventing anyone from their Religion but this is something Forbidden for Muslims so I taught to share with you peoples....

But right now I am using this distro and looking for future maybe they can fix these things but this is my opinion in respect all Religions :)

Magic Banana

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Trisquel Name is based on their beleive and their Celtic gods which is their Faith

I very much doubt Trisquel developers (or anybody actually) believe in Celtic gods. It is just a distinctive naming schema. Do you refuse to wear Nike shoes because they are named after the Greek goddess who personifies victory? The brand was not chosen based on its funders beliefs in antic gods either: https://www.businessinsider.com/how-nike-got-its-name-2016-1

Lèyon di li N.
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Joined: 02/11/2017

I don't wear those (because of human's and particularly children's exploitation) and now I've got another reason not to use it and to promote not to use it within religious circles. Thank you.

Your analogy is just pointing to another problem with another brand, that is off-topic. Are you a believer to the one and only God of the bible or of the Quran (that is the same God even though the prescriptions on those different books doesn't match)? If no, you are just not concerned by this discussion and trying to makes us ignore this topic is just an attempt to interfere in something that is not of your concern.

Now, of course, you are concerned, as a Trisquel user, on the choice Trisquel would make about it and of course, your opinion on that is welcome.

Legimet
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Joined: 12/10/2013

I agree with you completely about not wearing Nike. I couldn't care less about their brand name, but they are well known for their use of sweatshops.

SabirSaleem90
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Joined: 10/03/2021

I have my understanding and know what is right...

But the thing was that using name of Religious Personalities in any product whatever Nike or whatever but some people avoid to use really if you research on internet and see the taught of Muslims for Nike also...

it was just suggestion that belief is our other side and product should be excluded from that names so all types of people use that product without concerning with peacefully....

Hope my words are now understandable more :)

andyprough
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Joined: 02/12/2015

>"I very much doubt Trisquel developers (or anybody actually) believe in Celtic gods."

Other than some later Greek and Roman reports on some of the names of Celtic gods, it appears we know almost nothing about actual ancient Celtic religious practices. A lot of what has been written about druids and so forth in modern times has probably been anthropological guess-work, or simply works of historical fiction passed off as fact. We have just a few passing references to them from observers such as Julius Caesar.

Lèyon di li N.
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Joined: 02/11/2017

Salute Sabir,

It's good that you came up with this subject because I was thinking about expressing my thought on that and didn't know where to begin.

So, I'm a believer to the one and only God of the bible (and don't tell me about the “three gods” of the Christians, that's just a misunderstanding by Muslims about Christianity, though I would agree on the hyperdulia being doubtful, but that's another off-topic); I'm not in any particular established religion. I've been Christian, but now, I see so much problem with Christianity that I moved to something else more based on the Hebrew part of the bible but not rejecting the synoptical Good News. Well, I won't detail more on that because this is kinda off-topic.

Trisquel's name is related to a symbol tied to what we know about Celtic religion, so, first observation, it's not directly about any god of this believe, but just a symbol used in this religion (and that has been re-used by some ecclesiastic Christians, by the way); but, some Trisquel releases ("Toutatis", "Taranis" comes-up in my mind) are some of this polytheist's god's name. In the bible, what is forbidden is to eat food sacrificed to idols, but influence of gentile religions is severely criticised too, that's why I always felt there's a problem in using a distribution with such a name.

What can we do about it? I see three possible solutions: ignore it (and personally, I think that I ignored it for too long), asking for a rebranding (maybe talking about branding is not the good word, I'm no English's native speakers, so I mean changing the name and logotype for something more neutral) and see what happens or doing a fork (I think it is more reasonable to ask for a “rebranding” first then directly doing a fork, but we might already think (and speak) about it.

SabirSaleem90
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Joined: 10/03/2021

Yes,

but using these distributions is permissible in Islam and other Religions as soon as they do not force us to do anything impermissible.

Example 1: if we go to Christian School where teachers taught student the subject of their God but we attend our classes and our beleive are different so that doesn't matter.

Likewise if we use distro and our Faith and Beleive isn't in celtic gods so that is same and we are not doing any harm.

but this point every Muslim and every person can't understand easily and everyone has their own intellect.

so I prefer to avoid using names of these type on products so all peoples can use without thinking and wasting time on these.

are you understanding my point of view.

otherwise why I was using this distro from a Year I am not much concerned I take this thing lightly but my fellows still using UBUNTU just because this slight mistake of dev of Trisquel.

Lèyon di li N.
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Joined: 02/11/2017

In the torah (and the rest of the “tanakh”), there are many examples where Hebrews, just by living with pagans, became pagans and I tend to think that every-day's influence has more impact that we might think.
I think that your example is not really good because Christian's God and Muslim's God is the same (one and only) God, now, there are lots of disagreement (trinity being the most obvious, but there are many others) but we have that in common. Would it be the same with a Hindu school? I don't think so because the huge theological deference makes it harder (with time) to cope with people having such a religion by keeping full faith in you own religion (didn't it lead to Pakistan's creation?).

andyprough
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Joined: 02/12/2015

I don't think you could properly call ancient Celtic mythic god names "religious", as probably no one has followed that system religiously for well over a thousand years. As a Christian and a student of Christian history it's not an issue to me - they are just words. Unless I was to add some unholy significance to it, the words have no power. They are simply historical. We live in a post-Roman world where our months and days of the week are named after ancient gods - no need to be squeamish about using other historical terms.

lanun
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Joined: 04/01/2021

As an accepted Cthulhu cultist myself, I also find these so-called Celtic deities not to be worth half a one-bit post. So weak. We Satanists pursue fully coherent ethics: if it is weak or gitignore, ignore or eat, if it is powerful or a dangling pointer, destroy and eat.

That's dialectics.

"You've murdered my cat. I'll kill you!"

That's causality.

andyprough
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Joined: 02/12/2015

"I murdered your cat because you injected it with meth-amphetamine and stuffed it down my trousers"

That's self defense.

lanun
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Joined: 04/01/2021

I couldn't agree more. It should have been : "You've murdered my cat, let's eat it!"

That's dialectics, again, not dumb causality.

andyprough
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Joined: 02/12/2015

I got Hepatitis from eating the raw, meth-injected cat that you fed to me.

That's personal injury law.

lanun
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Joined: 04/01/2021

"My cat has been petrified. I want to see some punishment!"

That's unfortunate. Poor cat.

I suspect you are in fact a basilisk.

Lèyon di li N.
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Joined: 02/11/2017

There are some neo-pagan cults and some of those are based on “Druidic” believes (whatever they are accurate or not), so, there's right now a religion using this symbolism and believing to the gods that gave name to some of trisquel's releases.

In French, only a part of the days of the week are named after ancient gods, “dimanche” and “lundi” just respectfully refer to the sun and the moon and not to any god related to it and “samedi” directly derives from “שַׁבָּת”, the last day of Hebrew's week that is the day of rest.

By the way, I might sometimes been squeamish (and of course I want to rename the days of the week, I already thought about something like: “undi”, “deudi”, “troidi”, “quatredi”, “cinquedi”, “sixedi” and keeping samedi).

Lèyon di li N.
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Naming things of the creation has a huge importance in the book of genesis, so, words have some power, it's just theological interpretation but it looks like that one is prominent in the Jewish religious communities. Moreover, does “Ἐν ἀρχῇ ἦν ὁ λόγος, καὶ ὁ λόγος ἦν πρὸς τὸν θεόν, καὶ θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος.” reminds you something? Maybe not in Greek, but you certainly know some of it's translation, most important in that “λόγος” is often translated with a capital initial letter: “Word”.
Now, even though Celtic's religion disappeared, nu-pagan's “Druidism” does exist and is a huge thing in European nu-paganism, and it's quite possible that whoever is responsible for trisquel naming is into this kind of believes.

Lèyon di li N.
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Joined: 02/11/2017

I knew I already answered that, why didn't I saw that?

SabirSaleem90
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I have my understanding and know what is right...

But the thing was that using name of Religious Personalities in any product whatever Nike or whatever but some people avoid to use due to Religious names on it but really if you research on internet and see the taught of Muslims for Nike also they avoid because the Holy Names on their shoes etc...

here the scenario is different but Muslims are concerned and Believe in One God and Trisquel represents Trinity and their distro names are based on Celtic gods anyways this is the opinion of Trisquel Dev Team...

I myself right now using Trisquel as the Best Open Source just because of stripped out non free blobs and I understand that already that name doesn't made the product useless the main thing product should be good & ethical and legal...

it was just suggestion that belief is our other side and product should be excluded from that names so all types of people use that product without concerning with peacefully....

Hope my words are now understandable more :)

lanun
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Joined: 04/01/2021

I couldn't agree more. It should have been : "You've murdered my cat, let's eat it!"

That's dialectics, again, not dumb causality.

SabirSaleem90
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Joined: 10/03/2021

Very Funny these are just words and there is no value of these words...

Well if we are using something like if Hindus use to Worship Cow and in India Muslim eat them they kill them...

Just write
"Is cow sacrifice banned in India?"

this is another story so peoples are very concern about these things and make their opinions.

Anyways what can be done.

just not use any God name in Distribution so all type of audience can take advantage of good distro without disturbing their Faith or anything because in Islam some people think that using Product which represent other God is impermissible and interpretate their logic.

so please understand what I mean to say not make the game of words :D

Anyways I welcome anyone suggestions because I am studying myself also....

Lèyon di li N.
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Joined: 02/11/2017

I could never agree on the statement: “these are just words”, words have meanings (and also origins), avoiding that just because it's “just” a brand or that this would only be the brand creators' concern is wrong in my point of view, when you use a word, you use it on the purpose of a meaning and if you name something after something else, you link those things by the word you use. Would you agree to name one of your children “Iblis”? One might argue “this is just a word” and according Islamic believe, Iblis is not a god, it's “just” a fallen angel.

By the way, what are you studying?

Lèyon di li N.
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Joined: 02/11/2017

Trisquel (the triskelion) does not represent trinity, it represent three bent human legs and though it has been used in different contexts, it's mostly tied to the so called “Druidic” religion that is polytheist and not Trinitarian.

I understand your friend that stopped using Trisquel because of this (though I don't understand his choice to use Ubuntu while it's certainly the worst choice concerning freedom).

And yes, I understand more your point now.

andyprough
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Joined: 02/12/2015

>"Trisquel (the triskelion) does not represent trinity, it represent three bent human legs and though it has been used in different contexts, it's mostly tied to the so called “Druidic” religion that is polytheist and not Trinitarian."

That's assuming that we actually know that much about the druids, which we probably don't. We know almost nothing about them, and people just fill in the blanks with their imaginations. We can't just avoid words because they mean something in other peoples' imaginations.

libredrs

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In ancient times...
Hundreds of years before the dawn of history
Lived a strange race of people... the Druids

No one knows who they were or what they were doing
But their legacy remains
Hewn into the living rock... Of Stonehenge

andyprough
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Greatest band of all time. "We've got armadillos in our trousers. It's really quite frightening."

libredrs

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You can't really dust for vomit.

andyprough
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And he may not have even been the most unfortunate death in the band. The guy who died of the unexplained gardening accident may have him beat. Or the guy who exploded on stage.

libredrs

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My favorite part is the two word review for Shark Sandwich.

Lèyon di li N.
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What we know is when trinity's concept appeared and Celtic's religion did exist for a while then.

SabirSaleem90
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Yes I see I was wrong in Trinity due to Trisquel Logo and their name resembles.

Anyway I see it is based on polytheism and celtic gods anyways the name of Trisquel versions are based on celtic gods which appears still issue obviously because name has its origins and meaning to use.

as far as security and freedom is concerned I am still using Trisquel and avoiding their these naming schema but for future they may do avoid this in version naming schema so would be very appreciated...

Thanks everyone to listen this :)

libredrs

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I hereby request that Trisquel 11 be named for Saint Hubbins, the Patron Saint of Quality Footwear.

Brian59

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People need to get over their religious bias against names. Trisquel is just a name and not ment to promote a religion. Example: My family is Buddhist but we celebrate Christmas. To us, Christmas represents a time of family togetherness and not some Christian Holiday. A name means what you want it to mean.

Lèyon di li N.
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Who are you to tell people what they need?
I do not recognise you any authority on that!

Lèyon di li N.
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Test.
I can't answer, so i test normal comment.
Edition: I think I figure out the problem. This comment can be removed, sorry.

Brian59

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narcissistic sociopath?

SabirSaleem90
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My basic example.

like Muslims Follow Islam and celebrates Ramadan in which they used to fast now I make a product and name it Ramadan so in each mind Muslims will be clicked.

so if have basic intellect you can understand naming terminology so better in Products we avoid using names of Religions because every Religion prevent Follow other Religions names and their festivals.

Thank you

lanun
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Joined: 04/01/2021

> Correct me If I am wrong

I do believe you are totally mistaken, and you have already been corrected multiple times. Everybody here loves Trisquel and nobody in their right mind should have a problem with its naming tradition, which is a reference to the very origins of the distro, to local culture and to history. If you fail to understand this basic fact and keep conflating it with religious matters, I'm afraid we cannot help you further. Please stop flooding our forum and copy-pasting your own posts. Thank you.

PS: I am reminded of a Sabir Saleem who was studying computer science at Trinity College, Dublin. Was it you?

SabirSaleem90
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Joined: 10/03/2021

here we can't do more and more voice Messages & also this is not a platform for that better for make you understand you can come on my official site where we can do Voice Messages & I can make better record voice.

https://wiggly.site/

Thank you.

soy comic
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Sabir I had a similar concern and a few years ago took some time to re-style or re-brand my Trisquel instance locally. I did not attempt to replace all the names of ancient gods in the text, so not a full re-brand, but I replaced some of the imagery with my preferred imagery. It is free software after all, we have the freedom to change it: re-style it, re-brand it, re-make it. I hope you find this encouraging.

Lèyon di li N.
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I did the same indeed, but that's hard to rebrand all, I did only a very little bit. Maybe there are some scripts for that, I don't know.
I used a graphical representation of the word “computer” in Francophone Belgian Sign Language (as I was learning it) to use as a logotype.

SabirSaleem90
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But yes I understand that this is open source in free in freedom point of view so obviously we can make whole project from using this.

but this way so obviously there is a chance to change instances and other things locally and it's time consuming I was looking for a solution for every person who even do not having programming or any skills but concerned due to their Religions Obligations and want to fix that issue so that would be appreciate if Trisquel team understand and take some good steps.

Because I see many distro they are out of box from Religions or any Diety names of any particular Religion if we are using some softwares we're participating with them with their branding it this thing is very discouraging and disappointed.

I think I made my point of view in very easy words...:)

here I am not saying that we should not respect peoples from different Religion or background all we're brothers in the means of Humanity...

See verses of our Holy Quran

“Allah does not forbid you from showing kindness and dealing justly with those who have not fought you due to your faith or driven you out of your homes. Allah loves those who deal justly. Allah only forbids you from those people that fought you because of your faith, drove you out of your homes and helped in your expulsion, that you take them as intimate associates. And whosoever takes them as intimate associates, then it is they who are the wrongdoers.” [al-Quran, 60:8-9]

But when we are bound to use other peoples software with their God or anything which we do not Worship so that is not permissible and make some issues in this case.

Correct me If I am wrong

Thank you

lanun
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Joined: 04/01/2021

> Correct me If I am wrong

I do believe you are totally mistaken, and you have already been corrected multiple times. Everybody here loves Trisquel and nobody in their right mind should have a problem with its naming tradition, which is a reference to the very origins of the distro, to local culture and to history. If you fail to understand this basic fact and keep conflating it with religious matters, I'm afraid we cannot help you further. Please stop flooding our forum and copy-pasting your own posts. Thank you.

PS: I am reminded of a Sabir Saleem who was studying computer science at Trinity College, Dublin. Was it you?

SabirSaleem90
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Joined: 10/03/2021

But yes I understand that this is open source in free in freedom point of view so obviously we can make whole project from using this.

but this way so obviously there is a chance to change instances and other things locally and it's time consuming I was looking for a solution for every person who even do not having programming or any skills but concerned due to their Religions Obligations and want to fix that issue so that would be appreciate if Trisquel team understand and take some good steps.

Because I see many distro they are out of box from Religions or any Diety names of any particular Religion if we are using some softwares we're participating with them with their branding it this thing is very discouraging and disappointed.

I think I made my point of view in very easy words...:)

here I am not saying that we should not respect peoples from different Religion or background all we're brothers in the means of Humanity...

See verses of our Holy Quran

“Allah does not forbid you from showing kindness and dealing justly with those who have not fought you due to your faith or driven you out of your homes. Allah loves those who deal justly. Allah only forbids you from those people that fought you because of your faith, drove you out of your homes and helped in your expulsion, that you take them as intimate associates. And whosoever takes them as intimate associates, then it is they who are the wrongdoers.” [al-Quran, 60:8-9]

But when we are bound to use other peoples software with their God or anything which we do not Worship so that is not permissible and make some issues in this case.

Correct me If I am wrong

Thank you

lanun
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Joined: 04/01/2021

> Correct me If I am wrong

I do believe you are totally mistaken, and you have already been corrected multiple times. Everybody here loves Trisquel and nobody in their right mind should have a problem with its naming tradition, which is a reference to the very origins of the distro, to local culture and to history. If you fail to understand this basic fact and keep conflating it with religious matters, I'm afraid we cannot help you further. Please stop flooding our forum and copy-pasting your own posts. Thank you.

PS: I am reminded of a Sabir Saleem who was studying computer science at Trinity College, Dublin. Was it you?

SabirSaleem90
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Joined: 10/03/2021

this is not a permanent solution that I was asking because a layman who do not know basic programming can not edit things and if the person is also concerned so devs of Trisquel should change their naming schema so all peoples having any background can take advantage of this platform.

Thank you

libredrs

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The 'naming schema' is apparently not going to change.

You can live with it, 'rebrand' for yourself (as well as others) as suggested or use another distribution. Why is that so difficult to accept? Time to move on.

Lèyon di li N.
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Joined: 02/11/2017

A rebranded version might be done and downloadable, all we need is motivated people to do that and find a host to do that. If I'm not alone, I would be please to participate to such a project.

lanun
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Joined: 04/01/2021

> Correct me If I am wrong

I do believe you are totally mistaken, and you have already been corrected multiple times. Everybody here loves Trisquel and nobody in their right mind should have a problem with its naming tradition, which is a reference to the very origins of the distro, to local culture and to history. If you fail to understand this basic fact and keep conflating it with religious matters, I'm afraid we cannot help you further. Please stop flooding our forum and copy-pasting your own posts. Thank you.

PS: I am reminded of a Sabir Saleem who was studying computer science at Trinity College, Dublin. Was it you?

Lèyon di li N.
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Joined: 02/11/2017

I didn't even read all, could you please accept that not every body do think like you do and that you will not impose your opinion? If you close yourself to other's opinion, discussion is useless, so, please, don't say anything if you can't accept that others have another opinion then yours because such intervention is just useless. It looks like all you want is pressurise people not thinking like you.
Really, I'm sick of this disrespectful attitude that some people have in this discussion.